TheGrebs.com:IRC Logs:#xen:2006:03:14

---	Log	opened Tue Mar 14 00:00:32 2006
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03:40	<mooli>	hey aliguori
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08:07	<buggs>	hmm, virtualization based rootkits that run the compromised OS in a VM:
08:07	<buggs>	http://www.eecs.umich.edu/Rio/papers/king06.pdf
08:09	<tonfa>	they expect people not to notice that the bios screen is missing
08:09	<tonfa>	or the the reported hardware is different
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08:11	[~]	buggs counts the family members that would even consider it an improvement not to see the bios ...
08:11	<buggs>	"hey install this it makes your computer reboot faster"
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08:15	<tonfa>	actually not according to the numbers
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11:09	<simes>	did anyone get xen up and running on slackware (10.2)?
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13:18	<movement>	hmm, isn't the hg repository instant?
13:18	<movement>	keir says he's committed something that's not there yet
13:19	<tonfa>	movement: i think there is a sort of mirror
13:20	<movement>	hmpph
13:20	<aliguori>	movement, there's a staging tree that has to pass regressions before being pushed publicly
13:21	<aliguori>	it usually takes about a day depending on whether it breaks regressions
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13:24	<movement>	can I pull that tree?
13:27	<aliguori>	movement, no :-/
13:27	<movement>	guess I'll wait then :) Keir gave me a scary time limit!
13:30	<buggs>	tonfa, because they used virtualpc/vmware and not xen, domU don't boot slower and save the bios phase
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13:53	<sdague>	movement: I would encourage you to poke at Kier to open up his staging tree ;) We brought it up at xensummit, but the idea seems to have died out
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13:54	<movement>	done!
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14:10	<sdague>	I wish ewan made it out to irc from time to time, I'd like to try some real time debugging on my issue
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14:40	<hollisb>	ooooh, hg diff includes the function name in the output now (like GNU diff -p)
14:40	<hollisb>	I like :)
14:41	<tonfa>	you can thank cmason
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15:53	<hollisb>	hmm, is CRASH_DEBUG supposed to be set automatically somehow?
15:54	<hollisb>	i.e. depending on the Makefile's value of $(crash_debug)?
15:57	<rharper>	hollisb: xen/Rules.mk:54 adds -DCRASH_DEBUG to CFLAGS if you pass crash_debug=y to make
15:57	<hollisb>	ah ha
15:57	<hollisb>	thanks, I was using grep -w
15:57	<rharper>	np
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17:06	<movement>	anybody know what the point of all this guest handle stuff is?
17:08	<movement>	it seems a little baffling to run around playing macro games for what is just a pointer into guest memory
17:09	<riel>	maybe related to memory protection?
17:10	<aliguori>	movement, you mean the macro thing?
17:10	<movement>	yeah
17:10	<movement>	riel: it just degrades to copy_from/to_user though.
17:10	<aliguori>	hollisb explained it a bit ago as some sort of static type checking mechanism
17:10	<aliguori>	i think
17:10	<aliguori>	i never fully understood it
17:10	<ns>	ricardoz: ping
17:11	<movement>	hrm. I don't see how evtchn_port_t * isn't typechecked :)
17:11	<hollisb>	movement: yeah, Keir wanted it so you can't just pass anything into copy_to/from_user() (which accept void *)
17:11	<aliguori>	oh
17:11	<aliguori>	but ensuring the types are still compatible?
17:12	<aliguori>	__builtin_types_compatible_p
17:12	<aliguori>	is the right solution for that
17:12	<movement>	so it's just typechecking that the copy_*_user() in/out parameters are the same type?
17:12	<hollisb>	movement: yes
17:13	<movement>	indeed, aliguori's suggestion would be sooooo much less obtuse :)
17:13	<hollisb>	then please suggest it. that GUEST_HANDLE crap is mucking up my cscope ;)
17:13	[~]	aliguori looks for definition of GUEST_HANDLE
17:13	<movement>	mine too :)
17:14	<movement>	I'll try to find time this week to knock something together...
17:14	[~]	DV watches the kernel circus :-)
17:14	<hollisb>	aliguori: xen/include/asm/guest_handle.h, iirc
17:14	<hollisb>	movement: cool
17:15	<movement>	now here's hoping I didn't totally screw up the backport to handle-less xen ...
17:21	<aliguori>	a more portable trick is just to use a macro and do something like #define copy_to_user(a, b, c) ({sizeof(&a == &b); __copy_to_user(a, b, c);})
17:21	<aliguori>	i think that's the trick min/max tends to use...
17:22	<aliguori>	since copy_to_user returns an int, you can just use a , too and then it's totally portable
17:23	<hollisb>	hrm, yeah, and that trick is used in quite a few places in Xen in fact
17:23	<hollisb>	so perhaps Keir had some other idea in mind at the time
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17:25	<zztzed>	Hey, this may be a dumb question, but is there any way to make sure a domU always starts with the same ID? The users' manual says to pass vmid=x to xm create, but that doesn't seem to work, and the vmid parameter isn't mentioned in xmdomain.cfg(5)...
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17:26	<hollisb>	aliguori: I think the handle stuff may help if I ever get back to trying 32-bit dom0 tools with a 64-bit Xen
17:27	<aliguori>	hollisb, howso?
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17:29	<hollisb>	because I can make those pointers in the dom0 interface not 64-bit pointers
17:29	<hollisb>	and have both sides understand that
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17:45	<zztzed>	Nevermind, it was a dumb question... I misunderstood the docs.
17:52	[~]	hollisb decides 6pm is not a good time to start refactoring the Makefiles
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17:55	<@MarkW>	I eat far too much junk food.
17:55	<@MarkW>	i think it'll make me better at coding
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17:58	<tonfa>	is there any documentation on grant tables ?
17:58	<tonfa>	i couldn't find any in the wiki
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18:00	<@MarkW>	tonfa: ummm, probably not much
18:00	<@MarkW>	i wrote some up for the interface manual, so you could look at that
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18:00	<tonfa>	ok
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18:01	<@MarkW>	tonfa: it's done using a combination of actual hypercalls and memory operations that guarantee atomic changes to the table
18:02	<tonfa>	it isn't usable from userspace, am i right ?
18:02	<tonfa>	(in dom0)
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18:04	<tonfa>	bbl
18:05	<@MarkW>	tonfa: Not in a straightforward way... a nice thing to have would be a generic kernel interface for app memory sharing that would "do the right thing". but we don't have that yet.
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18:57	<@MarkW>	aliguori: Don't suppose you run ubuntu?
18:57	<@MarkW>	aliguori: I'm following your lead and installing XGl...
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19:02	<aliguori>	MarkW, yup, I do in fact
19:02	<aliguori>	MarkW, what's your graphics card?
19:04	<aliguori>	MarkW, my ati card required some serious vodoo for it to work..
19:10	<caker>	:hvm/svm/svm.c:821: undefined reference to `gva_to_gpa'
19:10	[~]	caker hmms
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---	Log	closed Wed Mar 15 00:00:29 2006