TheGrebs.com:IRC Logs:#openttd:2008:01:07

---	Log	opened Mon Jan 07 00:00:54 2008
00:01	\|-\|	nairan [~Maui_key@p5498DD1A.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
00:01	\|-\|	mcbane [~Maui_key@p5498F240.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:04	\|-\|	llugo [~lugo@p4FD5C30C.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:05	\|-\|	Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N750P030.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd
00:11	<Gonozal_VIII>	why would you want to fund factories close to farms... transporting that stuff further away generates much more money
00:16	<Gonozal_VIII>	you could want farms + factory on one side of the map and the same on the other side to avoid empty vehicles on the way back...
00:18	<Gonozal_VIII>	that's not easy... you need full load order to get high rating but when both sides have unbalanced production, most trains wait on one side...
00:19	<Gonozal_VIII>	what happened to the patch where you could set: leave station if x other trains are loading or load for max y days?
00:26	\|-\|	tokai [~tokai@p54B82931.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
00:26	\|-\|	mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
00:45	\|-\|	llugo [~lugo@p4FD5DA17.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
00:51	\|-\|	s3mt3x [~dfddf@p549163DB.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:52	\|-\|	lugo [~lugo@p4FD5F4E9.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
00:56	\|-\|	roboman [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
00:56	\|-\|	roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
00:57	\|-\|	s3mt3x [~dfddf@p549141F2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
01:07	\|-\|	Greyscale changed nick to Greysc[a]le
01:19	\|-\|	Deathmaker [~Miranda@dslb-082-083-229-125.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
01:20	\|-\|	s3mt3x [~dfddf@p549141F2.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit []
01:54	\|-\|	robotboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
01:54	\|-\|	roboman [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
01:55	\|-\|	XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd
01:55	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-84-227-22-236.adslplus.ch] has joined #openttd
02:02	\|-\|	Hendikins changed nick to Hendikins\|QLD
02:15	\|-\|	ludde [~ludde@ua-83-227-238-252.cust.bredbandsbolaget.se] has joined #openttd
02:26	\|-\|	Wezz6400 [~Wezz6400@145-118-108-75.fttx.bbned.nl] has joined #openttd
02:27	\|-\|	peterbrett [~peter@124-217.0-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #openttd
02:34	\|-\|	peter__ [~petern@217.151.109.242] has joined #openttd
02:37	\|-\|	DeGhost [~s@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
02:39	<peter__>	lo
02:40	<Gonozal_VIII>	ru
02:40	\|-\|	shodan [user@xerxes.foocode.net] has joined #openttd
02:43	<robotboy>	barb
02:43	<Gonozal_VIII>	:S
02:44	<Gonozal_VIII>	barb?
02:44	<robotboy>	you said ru so I say barb
02:44	<robotboy>	and peter__ said lo
02:44	<robotboy>	look at his user page on the ottd wiki
02:47	<Gonozal_VIII>	aaah
02:47	<Gonozal_VIII>	had to google wtf rhubarb is
02:50	<Gonozal_VIII>	i had no idea what lo was supposed to mean, the only thing that came into my mind was "links oben" where i replied ru for "rechts unten" :-)
02:51	<Gonozal_VIII>	where links is left, rechts is right, oben is top and unten is bottom
02:51	<peter__>	mmm, rhubarb
02:51	<peter__>	lo is short for 'lo is short for hello
02:52	<robotboy>	yum
02:52	\|-\|	Frostregen_ [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-182-009.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
02:52	<Gonozal_VIII>	aaaaah i c lo 2 u 2
02:52	<peter__>	what?
02:53	<Gonozal_VIII>	i see, hello to you too ;-)
02:53	<peter__>	no no no, you're doing it wrong
02:54	<Gonozal_VIII>	you can't do that wrong, it's wrong by design
02:54	<Gonozal_VIII>	;-)
02:54	<peter__>	so don't do it
02:55	<peter__>	or i shall have to figure out how to get ops here ;p
02:55	<Gonozal_VIII>	hey, you started it :P
02:55	<peter__>	no, "lo" is just a (spoken) abbreviation, not txtspk
02:56	<Gonozal_VIII>	spoken? didn't hear it ;-)
02:56	<peter__>	i did
02:57	<robotboy>	laugh out loud
02:57	\|-\|	Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-147-229.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
02:57	<peter__>	actually i did say "lol" once instead of laughing :o
02:57	<Gonozal_VIII>	me too^^
02:57	\|-\|	Frostregen_ changed nick to Frostregen
02:58	\|-\|	gfldex [~dex@dslb-088-074-150-220.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
02:58	<peter__>	bah, sacro didn't play on my nightly that i set up for him :(
03:00	\|-\|	peterbrett [~peter@124-217.0-85.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:00	\|-\|	gfldex_ [~dex@dslb-088-074-171-196.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:00	\|-\|	lugo [~lugo@p4FD5E378.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
03:01	<Gonozal_VIII>	http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?f=32&t=35658 <-- seen that suggestion? brilliant! could've been by me!
03:06	\|-\|	mindlesstux [~mindlesst@2001:470:1f07:16c:240:f4ff:fe52:a74e] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:07	\|-\|	\|Bastiaan\| [~Bastiaan@77.60.199.138] has joined #openttd
03:07	\|-\|	llugo [~lugo@p4FD5DA17.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:07	<peter__>	why not just use buoys?
03:08	<Gonozal_VIII>	doesn't help yapf much
03:08	<Gonozal_VIII>	that would require the pathfinder to be dumber
03:09	<Gonozal_VIII>	and then you have to place a buoy on every corner.. naaah not funny
03:11	<Noldo>	there are better solutions to the ship pathfinding
03:11	<Gonozal_VIII>	but i thought about that too... that the pathfinder works kind of like bjarnis little pirate robot
03:12	<Gonozal_VIII>	and requests additional buoys if the simulated path doesn't leads where it should
03:12	<Gonozal_VIII>	-s
03:15	<Gonozal_VIII>	but then i had the shipping line idea... where you can define if a water tile should be used by ships or not...
03:15	<Gonozal_VIII>	after that i realised that it would be much easier to simply use canals in water for that
03:26	<peter__>	canals in water have other side effects thouggh
03:26	[~]	peter__ > work
03:26	\|-\|	peter__ [~petern@217.151.109.242] has quit [Quit: peter__]
03:47	\|-\|	peter__ [~peter@petern.bnsnet.co.uk] has joined #openttd
03:47	<_Roujin>	time to go for me, goodbye
03:48	\|-\|	_Roujin [~Manuel300@mnch-4d04ebf7.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit []
04:12	\|-\|	Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N750P030.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:16	\|-\|	peterbrett [~peter@48-159.79-83.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #openttd
04:20	<CIA-1>	OpenTTD: rubidium * r11775 /trunk/src/ (22 files): -Codechange: move all autoreplace/autorenew functions to a single location.
04:21	\|-\|	DeGhost [~s@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd
04:22	\|-\|	Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
04:22	\|-\|	dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-220-170.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
04:27	\|-\|	Dominik [~Dominik@dslb-084-063-015-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
04:33	\|-\|	llugo [~lugo@p4FD5C69C.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
04:39	<dih>	can net_frame_freq have an influence on desyncs?
04:40	\|-\|	lugo [~lugo@p4FD5E378.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:41	<Rubidium>	dih: yes
04:41	<dih>	in what way?
04:41	<dih>	and thanks for a fast response Rubidium :-)
04:42	<Rubidium>	that the desyncs can be 'delayed' up to net_frame_freq frames
04:42	<dih>	so they will occure either way
04:42	<dih>	?
04:43	<Rubidium>	technically yes
04:43	<dih>	thank you :-)
04:45	<Dominik>	is it possible to specify a searchpath in the cfg file?
04:46	<blathijs>	Dominik: A searchpath for what?
04:47	<Dominik>	the standard data files
04:48	\|-\|	Dominik [~Dominik@dslb-084-063-015-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has left #openttd [Leaving]
04:48	<Rubidium>	very useful to leave at this moment...
04:48	\|-\|	Dominik [~Dominik@dslb-084-063-015-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
04:49	<Dominik>	sorry, disconnected
04:49	<Rubidium>	Dominik: the 'problem' is that the configuration file is technically (for ottd) a datafile too... so it's the famous chicken-egg-problem
04:49	<Dominik>	i want to load the value of e.g. SP_PERSONAL_DIR from openttd.cfg
04:50	<dih>	why?
04:50	<Rubidium>	SP_WORKING_DIR is 'easier'
04:50	<Rubidium>	unless you use OSX
04:50	<dih>	:-P
04:50	[~]	dih uses OS X
04:51	<Dominik>	ok, then i have to find a workaround. because on the ds the binary is loaded into ram as a whole. there are no paths at all, except on the external flash card
04:52	<Dominik>	and standard behavior for ds homebrew is to have a conig file in the root dir which tells the program where to load files from
04:52	<Rubidium>	that's a completely different 'problem' imo
04:53	<Rubidium>	what about making "root"/openttd.cfg a 'stub' with only the path to the place where all ottd files are?
04:54	<Rubidium>	then you can easily override SP_WORKING_DIR or whatever of those search paths to the place described in "root"/openttd.cfg without messing up the whole search path system
04:55	<Dominik>	if everything else fails i'll have to do that. but i'd prefer to have all configuration in one file
04:55	<blathijs>	Can't you set SP_WORKING_DIR with a commandline option?
04:56	<Rubidium>	the 'major' problem is that the configuration file is searched for after the search paths have been determined
04:56	<blathijs>	Or simply use the current working dir of the process?
04:56	<Dominik>	maybe i'll just put an extra line in the cfg file with the dir and parse that before anything else
04:56	<blathijs>	(I'm probably missing something essential here.. :-p)
04:57	<Dominik>	blathijs: there's no such thing as a working directory. imagine the game being started from a rom card
04:58	<Dominik>	in fact there's no directory structure (posix or other) at all. ^^
04:58	<blathijs>	In that case, you could add a commandline option to set SP_WORKING_DIR ?
04:59	<Dominik>	there's no command line. the game is loaded from rom without being able to pass any arguments
04:59	<dih>	hardcode it :-D
04:59	\|-\|	UnderBuilder [~chatzilla@168.226.106.219] has joined #openttd
05:00	<Dominik>	if i hardcode it, everyone is forced to use the paths that i chose
05:00	<Dominik>	but loading the cfg file twice should work. once in the beginning to find the path and once during the regular loading
05:02	<dih>	Rubidium, may i ask your personal oppinion on http://pub.dihedral.de/openttd/r11767_network_nextgame_reload_cfg.diff ?
05:05	<blathijs>	Dominik: That's not all that different from how it works on other systems
05:05	<blathijs>	Dominik: You'll have to store your cfg in ~/.openttd on linux, for example
05:06	<blathijs>	Though there might be some cmd line option to override that, though
05:06	<Rubidium>	blathijs: there's not cmd line to do that
05:06	<blathijs>	Doesn't the DS have some generic configuration storage mechanism?
05:06	<blathijs>	In which you just can store a single value with the path of the other files
05:06	<blathijs>	?
05:06	<Rubidium>	but... if you already have a openttd.cfg in your current working directory or any of the other search paths, it will not place it in ~/.openttd/
05:07	<Rubidium>	dih: ieuw... vardef :(
05:08	<Dominik>	blathijs: well, commercial games have an area on the gamecards to store information. but it's not a "filesystem" a user could edit
05:08	<dih>	Rubidium: what else should i do?
05:09	<Dominik>	i'll get that to work, it's the least of my problems. i just wanted to check with you if there's a quick and easy cfg option i missed ;)
05:12	<dih>	_network_frame_freq is set in settings.cpp:1282 to default to 0 ?? how come?
05:13	<UnderBuilder>	now the livery newgrf is the one that gives the unsafe for static use
05:26	<dih>	Rubidium: you have any other suggestion how to do that without vardef?
05:28	<Rubidium>	you have absolutely no idea how to code something in C(++), haven't you?
05:28	<Rubidium>	vardef is just an ugly hack by someone who was lazy
05:31	<dih>	no - i dont :-) i just use what is around, read what is there and work with that
05:31	<dih>	wanted to add a network setting so copied from another network setting
05:32	<dih>	as i _assumed_ it would be ok to do so
05:32	<dih>	as it then would be the _same_ as something else already in use :-P
05:33	<dih>	_but_ i am eager to learn :-)
05:41	\|-\|	Dominik [~Dominik@dslb-084-063-015-037.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
05:42	<dih>	Rubidium: last 4 lines are all for you ^^
05:42	<dih>	*5 lines
05:49	\|-\|	robotboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
05:49	\|-\|	roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
05:53	<dih>	Rubidium: vardef is used in 14 files...
05:56	<Rubidium>	you haven't noticed that the number of vardefs is declining?
05:56	<dih>	no
05:57	<dih>	but if i knew how, i would love to help
05:57	<dih>	i.e. if you tell me what to use instead, i'll happily send you a patch file that will get rid of them all :-D
05:58	<dih>	what say you to that Rubidium?
05:58	<Rubidium>	I rather do it myself as I otherwise have to carefully check where everything got moved to and such which probably takes more time than doing it myself
05:59	<dih>	oh
05:59	<dih>	ok
05:59	<Rubidium>	primarily because I do it whenever I'm reordering headers and such
05:59	<dih>	shame :-P
06:00	<Rubidium>	why?
06:00	<Rubidium>	not doing double (if not more) of the work is a shame?
06:01	<dih>	no - not being able to do it for you is a shame
06:02	<dih>	so in which file could i find an alternative to the vardef, so i could replace the one in that diff file?
06:05	<Rubidium>	the alternative is using defining it using extern and and declaring it somewhere in a .cpp file
06:06	<dih>	/somewhere/ ?
06:06	\|-\|	Roujin [~Manuel300@mnch-4d04ebf7.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #openttd
06:07	<dih>	can you point me to a file and perhaps a line :-P
06:07	<Roujin>	what was the command to get the newest revision displayed here?
06:08	<dih>	@OpenTTD youngest
06:08	<@DorpsGek>	dih: latest: r11775
06:09	<Roujin>	hmm
06:09	<Roujin>	and to find out what a specific revision changed? ^^
06:09	\|-\|	Vikthor [novotv6@pc404-19.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd
06:09	<dih>	@list OpenTTD
06:09	<@DorpsGek>	dih: bug, bugs, changed, commit, download, grf, grfs, info, port, ports, propset, servers, svn, thelog, and youngest
06:09	<dih>	choose your pick :-P
06:10	<Roujin>	@OpenTTD commit 11775
06:10	<@DorpsGek>	Roujin: Commit by rubidium :: r11775 /trunk/src (22 files) (2008-01-07 09:19:53 UTC)
06:10	<@DorpsGek>	Roujin: -Codechange: move all autoreplace/autorenew functions to a single location.
06:10	<dih>	you can also use thim privately, with /msg DorpsGek
06:10	<Roujin>	thanks for the info :)
06:11	<Roujin>	i'm not very used to irc :P
06:11	<dih>	:-P
06:11	<dih>	you'll get it :-P
06:12	<Roujin>	i hate myself for having so many ideas for patches i could do...
06:13	<Roujin>	i'll never get sleep T_T
06:13	<dih>	a game is never as important as my sleep
06:13	<dih>	if i really need the sleep...
06:14	<Roujin>	but i bet this one was already made by someone: when building a station, it shows what is "delivered", not only what is "accepted"
06:15	<dih>	yes - that is good
06:15	<Roujin>	but it has surely been done.. hasn't it?
06:15	<dih>	Rubidium: can you point me to a file (perhaps with a line) so i can see an example?
06:15	<Roujin>	i mean.. come on.. it's so - obvious?
06:15	<dih>	i have no idea
06:15	<Rubidium>	I can show you a line, but then you still would have no idea I guess
06:16	<dih>	c'mon - it's not like i have never written a patch for ottd
06:16	<Rubidium>	command.cpp:21
06:17	[~]	Digitalfox Investigates that line
06:17	<dih>	and that used to be a vardef ?
06:17	<Rubidium>	don't know
06:17	<Roujin>	but i just stumbled over something... appearently it doesn't work properly for some standard industries - namely oil wells and SOME coal mines
06:18	[~]	dih will give it a try :-P
06:18	<Roujin>	i guess there must be something wrong with the function GetProductionAroundTiles...
06:19	<Roujin>	it works for all newgrf industries and for all standard industries except the oil wells and SOME coal mines
06:19	<Roujin>	SOME = appearently depending on which layout it has
06:19	<Roujin>	strange...
06:20	\|-\|	Sacro_ [~Ben@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
06:23	\|-\|	Sacro^ [~Ben@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
06:24	<dih>	Sacro is infesting the channel.... oO
06:27	\|-\|	Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:27	\|-\|	DeGhost [~s@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:28	\|-\|	DeGhost [~s@CPE0050ba8caf2c-CM0011aec4b06a.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #openttd
06:28	\|-\|	Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
06:30	\|-\|	Sacro_ [~Ben@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:31	\|-\|	roboman [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
06:31	\|-\|	roboboy [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
06:35	\|-\|	Sacro^ [~Ben@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:44	\|-\|	Vikthor [novotv6@pc404-19.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
06:48	\|-\|	Wolf01 [~wolf01@host45-58-dynamic.8-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd
06:51	\|-\|	Brianetta [~brian@82-39-52-234.cable.ubr03.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has joined #openttd
06:51	<Wolf01>	hello
07:01	<dih>	:-)
07:03	\|-\|	Progman [~progman@p57A1F1BA.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
07:13	<dih>	heh - it works ;-P
07:26	\|-\|	Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N762P018.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd
07:41	\|-\|	Bjarni [~Bjarni@0x50a46c2b.virnxx14.adsl-dhcp.tele.dk] has joined #openttd
07:41	\|-\|	mode/#openttd [+o Bjarni] by ChanServ
07:42	<Roujin>	so, brought out another patch :P
07:42	<Roujin>	now i'm off, see you all
07:43	\|-\|	Roujin [~Manuel300@mnch-4d04ebf7.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit []
07:43	\|-\|	Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N762P018.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
07:46	\|-\|	Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd
07:49	\|-\|	bumblebee [~nnscript@ti231110a080-4121.bb.online.no] has joined #openttd
07:54	\|-\|	roboman [~Leo@c211-30-60-34.carlnfd4.nsw.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:00	\|-\|	Noldo [vheino@jumi.lut.fi] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
08:00	\|-\|	Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-81-173-249-49.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd
08:01	\|-\|	Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-81-173-249-49.netcologne.de] has quit []
08:13	<@Bjarni>	hehe... when reading a commit log for something that lacks a policy like ours to actually write what the commit is about can be "interesting" at times
08:13	<@Bjarni>	- Small fix to make code work as intended. <--- isn't this what all fixes is supposed to do?
08:14	\|-\|	Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
08:14	<@Bjarni>	and... what is it trying to fix? :)
08:15	\|-\|	Diabolic-Angel [~dia@xdsl-81-173-249-49.netcologne.de] has joined #openttd
08:17	<Sacro>	i've gone from a north to a south facing room
08:17	<Sacro>	you really notice the difference
08:22	[~]	Bjarni is in a room facing both north and south
08:22	<@Bjarni>	beat that :P
08:22	<@Bjarni>	oh an it's facing east too
08:22	\|-\|	Ailure [Cat@194.47.44.155] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:23	<@Bjarni>	in fact it's facing all directions except the direction towards Sacro. This can't be a random thing :p
08:23	<Sacro>	well, i have a north facing window
08:23	<Sacro>	i think i have 3 external walls too :(
08:23	<@Bjarni>	you think?
08:24	<@Bjarni>	don't you know?
08:24	<Sacro>	i've not looked outside yet :p
08:24	<Sacro>	i have at least 2
08:24	<Sacro>	at most 3
08:24	<@Bjarni>	where are you?
08:24	<@Bjarni>	at home?
08:24	<Sacro>	my new room
08:24	<Sacro>	i moved yesterdya
08:24	<@Bjarni>	ohh
08:24	<@Bjarni>	to a new building?
08:24	<Sacro>	yep
08:25	<Sacro>	hot northern irish girl in this house
08:25	<@Bjarni>	got tired of getting rice every day?
08:25	<Sacro>	i love rice
08:25	<Sacro>	but my rice cooker is going back to China :(
08:25	<@Bjarni>	ohh
08:25	<Sacro>	well, the biological one is
08:25	<Sacro>	she's leaving me an electrical one
08:26	<@Bjarni>	those should be rather good
08:26	<@Bjarni>	well... some of them at least
08:26	<Sacro>	yes, they are
08:26	<murray>	:)
08:27	<@Bjarni>	Sacro: http://www.japanprobe.com/?p=3528 <-- you can even make more than just rice in it
08:27	<@Bjarni>	(no, I'm not going to translate the recipes... it's watch and learn :p )
08:28	<@Bjarni>	I would try this but I lack a proper rice cooker
08:29	<@Bjarni>	if I ever go to Asia then I might buy one
08:30	<@Bjarni>	hmm
08:31	<@Bjarni>	Sacro: about that rice cooker... do they use 230V in China?
08:31	<@Bjarni>	or 50 Hz for that matter
08:31	<Sacro>	she uses a plug converter
08:32	<Sacro>	but then her laptop will probably be 110-240
08:32	<Sacro>	@ 50-60
08:32	<@Bjarni>	they are making more and more that operates on 90-250V and 47-63 Hz
08:32	<@Bjarni>	one product to fit the entire world
08:33	<@Bjarni>	but it will not work well with heating elements
08:33	<@Bjarni>	it works with electronics and stuff like that that has to convert the voltage anyway
08:34	<@Bjarni>	Japan is feared when it comes to power frequency... they couldn't settle for either 50 or 60 Hz... so they use both >_<
08:35	<@Bjarni>	their powergrid is 50 Hz and the end transformers has AC-DC-AC converters to make 60 Hz and then the buildings can get both
08:35	<@Bjarni>	I think they are trying to get rid of 60 Hz though
08:37	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-84-227-22-236.adslplus.ch] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
08:40	\|-\|	LA[lord] [~chatzilla@ip157.cab20.ltln.starman.ee] has joined #openttd
08:40	<LA[lord]>	hello
08:42	<dih>	hi
08:43	<dih>	hello Bjarni
08:45	\|-\|	glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd
08:45	\|-\|	mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
08:45	\|-\|	KritiK [~Maxim@78-106-212-3.broadband.corbina.ru] has joined #openttd
08:54	\|-\|	pavel1269 [~pavel.g@48.140.broadband2.iol.cz] has joined #openttd
08:56	\|-\|	LA[lord]_ [~chatzilla@ip101.cab22.ltln.starman.ee] has joined #openttd
08:56	\|-\|	divo [~asd@0x4dd443c6.adsl.cybercity.dk] has joined #openttd
08:57	\|-\|	Noldo [vheino@jumi.lut.fi] has joined #openttd
09:01	\|-\|	LA[lord] [~chatzilla@ip157.cab20.ltln.starman.ee] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:01	\|-\|	LA[lord]_ changed nick to LA[lord]
09:02	\|-\|	helb [~helb@62.240.176.23] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
09:03	\|-\|	helb [~helb@62.240.176.23] has joined #openttd
09:05	\|-\|	Arbitrary [me@morgoth.alfar.co.uk] has joined #openttd
09:11	<@Bjarni>	hello dih
09:12	<LA[lord]>	what it takes to get a good sprite? Drawing skill... What do I lack? -"-
09:13	<@Bjarni>	a graphical editing app
09:13	<LA[lord]>	Gimp is very good...
09:13	<@Bjarni>	that can read png and use custom palette
09:14	<LA[lord]>	I guess it's drawing skill I lack...
09:14	<LA[lord]>	bah.. :(
09:14	<Wolf01>	i use graphics gale
09:15	<LA[lord]>	I can always try to draw again but at some poit, it gets useless, if other guys can do it ten times better ...
09:15	<@Bjarni>	LA[lord]: oh it would be a good thing to have a working grfcodec too
09:16	[~]	LA[lord] checks his grfcodec....wait a mom, he asked for what it takes for a good sprite...
09:16	\|-\|	Deathmaker [~Miranda@dslb-082-083-229-125.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:17	<@Bjarni>	well
09:17	<LA[lord]>	no actually it's the last time I try to draw rail depot..from scratch..it this is a failure too I'll make something else
09:18	<@Bjarni>	technically it's not needed to have the codec but it's usually a good idea
09:18	<LA[lord]>	You can post the sprites and let smb else code it, if you don't know nfo ...
09:18	<@Bjarni>	bugging everybody else to encode stuff for you might not be an ideal solution
09:19	<@Bjarni>	alternatively you can code support for XML based sprite additions to the game ;)
09:19	<LA[lord]>	then it seems to be fortunate that I have learned nfo and have grfcodec
09:19	\|-\|	dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-220-170.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: This computer has gone to sleep]
09:19	<LA[lord]>	you saw my thread about futuristic graphics system?
09:19	<LA[lord]>	It was atleast three months ago I suggested it :D
09:19	<LA[lord]>	or something like that, similar
09:20	<LA[lord]>	anyway, less talk, more drawing...
09:20	<LA[lord]>	I'll present you with something in some time
09:21	[~]	Bjarni notes to watch new graphics next month
09:21	<LA[lord]>	next month?
09:22	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has joined #openttd
09:22	<@Bjarni>	yeah
09:22	<@Bjarni>	when you are done
09:24	<LA[lord]>	grr...'
09:24	<LA[lord]>	If I draw, I draw quickly
09:24	<ludde>	when did i release the first openttd?
09:24	<LA[lord]>	(that explains the quality of my production though)
09:25	<@Bjarni>	err
09:25	<@Bjarni>	early 2004
09:25	<ludde>	really?
09:25	<Rubidium>	openttd-0.1.1 on sf is of 13-03-2004
09:25	<ludde>	aha, interesting.
09:26	<@Bjarni>	openttd-0.1.1 Notes (2004-03-13 15:00)
09:26	\|-\|	abcd [~Miranda@dslb-084-056-212-107.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
09:26	\|-\|	abcd changed nick to Guest2382
09:26	<ludde>	apparently i started work on it 2002
09:27	<ludde>	and the first version i gave to orudge was in march 2003
09:27	\|-\|	Ammller [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has joined #openttd
09:28	<ludde>	apparently then i stopped working on it for exactly one year :)
09:28	<@Bjarni>	why?
09:29	\|-\|	Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has joined #openttd
09:29	<ludde>	dunno
09:29	<ludde>	i guess i had abanboned it
09:29	<ludde>	but then all the publicity around the open sourcing gave me back some inspiration
09:30	<ludde>	2004-03-06: orudge: Sorry to keep nagging... but is anything going to happen with your TT reverse engineering/reconstruction?
09:30	<@orudge>	heh
09:30	<@Belugas>	hurray for that :)
09:30	<@orudge>	yes, indeed
09:30	<ludde>	2004-03-06: orudge: It's just it's very good, and it's a shame that it's doing nothing ;)
09:30	<@orudge>	I still have those logs somewhere
09:31	<ludde>	then i replied:
09:31	<ludde>	I can't tell, right now it's not on my list of prioritized projects
09:31	<ludde>	i don't have any plans to work on it, but maybe i change my mind in the future.
09:31	<@Bjarni>	I have a download of svn from the 15th of March 2004... the date I started porting OpenTTD
09:31	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:32	<@orudge>	Session Start (ICQ - xxxxxx): Thu Mar 06 17:07:58 2003
09:32	<@orudge>	xxxx: hello,
09:32	<@orudge>	you probably don't know me, but i've been working on reverse engineering ttd for a while.
09:32	<@orudge>	¬_¬
09:32	<@orudge>	I still have those old code snapshots and so on
09:32	<ludde>	http://home.strigeus.com/ttd.rar <-- my first cvs repo
09:32	<@orudge>	I never uploaded anything earlier than what was released as 0.1 though
09:33	<ludde>	probably lacks some stuff from the widget directory, unless i'm missing something
09:33	<@Bjarni>	how did you know that I'm searching for my HD for my old OTTD stuff right now?
09:33	<CIA-1>	OpenTTD: rubidium * r11776 /trunk/src/ (25 files in 2 dirs): -Codechange: more header splittings to reduce the dependencies.
09:33	<@orudge>	funky
09:33	<@Bjarni>	but it's most likely without the stuff I'm looking for :/
09:33	<ludde>	belugas asked me about it
09:33	<ludde>	(privately)
09:33	<ludde>	maybe he asked you too?
09:34	<@Bjarni>	sort of :)
09:34	[~]	Bjarni still wonders where he put the complete commit log of the old svn server
09:35	<@Belugas>	yeah... I'm looking at all the infos i can gather :)
09:35	<@orudge>	oh, and OpenTTD 0.1 never made it to SourceForge, but is available at http://www.tt-forums.net/openttd/openttd-0.1.zip
09:35	<@orudge>	iirc
09:35	\|-\|	frosch123 [~mtce@kolmogoroff.math.tu-clausthal.de] has joined #openttd
09:36	<frosch123>	Hello everyone
09:36	<@Belugas>	got that one, plus the the r607 snapshot
09:36	<@Belugas>	hello frosch :D
09:38	[~]	Belugas will install cvs tonight at home :)
09:39	[~]	orudge is just doing something
09:39	<@orudge>	which you may find useful
09:40	<Sacro>	is 0.1 playable online?
09:40	<@orudge>	no
09:40	<Sacro>	darn :p
09:41	<Sacro>	i wanted it on the master server
09:41	\|-\|	Guest2382 [~Miranda@dslb-084-056-212-107.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Quit: Miranda IM! Smaller, Faster, Easier. http://miranda-im.org]
09:41	<Sacro>	to see if anyone noticed
09:42	<LA[lord]>	but what is the first mp proof revision then...
09:43	<@Belugas>	3.4 or 3.6 was online only, iirc
09:43	<@Belugas>	0.3.4...
09:43	<@Belugas>	of course...
09:45	<DaleStan>	Sacro: Well, you could just compile your own version (or even hex-edit a compiled one) so "0.5.3" becomes "0.1.0".
09:45	<@Belugas>	and 0.3.6 was more stable as much as network operations
09:45	<@orudge>	earlier versions did have networking support
09:45	<@orudge>	just not very good support :P
09:46	<LA[lord]>	heh
09:47	<@Belugas>	ok... good to know. My fisrt contact with ottd was on 0.3.4
09:49	<@orudge>	fo those who are interested: http://www.tt-forums.net/openttd/cgi-bin/viewvc.cgi
09:52	\|-\|	dih [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-220-170.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
09:52	[~]	Belugas salutes orudge's initiative :D
09:53	<peter__>	heh, silly cvs revisions
09:54	<@orudge>	quite
09:54	<peter__>	couldn't do nightlies with that
09:54	<ludde>	it feels so sad that it was like 5 years ago...
09:54	<@orudge>	time does fly
09:55	<ludde>	and scummvm was even longer...
09:56	<peter__>	and now look at the mess we've made of it
09:56	<ludde>	yeah
09:57	<ludde>	(or tbh.. i have no idea cause i havn't really looked at the source since I quit :p)
09:57	<peter__>	coughc++cough
09:58	<ludde>	didn't C work well enough?
09:58	<dih>	hey :-)
09:59	<@Belugas>	it's the first step toward migration to java
09:59	<@Belugas>	NOT ;)
09:59	<@orudge>	I still think we should rewrite OpenTTD in Whitespace ;D
09:59	<+glx>	C works well, but C++ has some nice features
09:59	<ludde>	C++ has a lot of anti-features too
09:59	<+glx>	right
10:02	<dih>	ludde: you dont like c++?
10:03	\|-\|	pavel1269 [~pavel.g@48.140.broadband2.iol.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
10:04	<ludde>	i like some features
10:04	<LA[lord]>	I don't get what's the main differences between c and c++?
10:04	<LA[lord]>	both are similar aren't they?
10:05	<frosch123>	dih: If you like something, then you do not know it well enough :)
10:05	[~]	LA[lord] knows nothing about coding
10:05	<Sacro>	DaleStan: yes, thats true
10:05	<Sacro>	make RELEASE=foo
10:06	<dih>	frosch123: that is a very pesimistic approach
10:06	<Sacro>	dih: or cynical
10:09	\|-\|	MarkASLEEP changed nick to Mark
10:13	\|-\|	pavel1269 [~pavel.g@48.140.broadband2.iol.cz] has joined #openttd
10:15	<dih>	r11777 compile error: src/unix.cpp:246: error: 'ttd_strlcpy' was not declared in this scope
10:15	<Rubidium>	lol ;)
10:15	<pavel1269>	!openttd
10:15	\|-\|	Ailure [Cat@194.47.44.155] has joined #openttd
10:16	<pavel1269>	!help
10:16	<pavel1269>	@help
10:16	<@DorpsGek>	pavel1269: help [<plugin>] [<command>]
10:16	<pavel1269>	openttd
10:16	<Sacro>	@password
10:16	<@DorpsGek>	Sacro: Error: That operation cannot be done in a channel.
10:16	<Sacro>	ooh
10:16	<pavel1269>	wiki
10:16	<pavel1269>	!wiki
10:16	<pavel1269>	@wiki
10:17	<pavel1269>	hmm ...
10:17	<pavel1269>	@help wiki
10:17	<@DorpsGek>	pavel1269: Error: There is no command "wiki".
10:17	<dih>	@list
10:17	<@DorpsGek>	dih: Ctcp, Filter, Format, Math, Misc, OpenTTD, Scheduler, Seen, Topic, WT2, and XMLRPC
10:17	<pavel1269>	OpenTTD
10:17	<pavel1269>	@OpenTTD
10:17	<dih>	pavell: you can use those also in /msg DorpsGek <command>
10:17	<CIA-1>	OpenTTD: rubidium * r11778 /trunk/src/unix.cpp: -Fix: compiles with ICONV failed.
10:18	<dih>	:-)
10:18	<pavel1269>	he retire to tell me anything :))
10:18	<dih>	because you are not useing it correctly!
10:18	<Rubidium>	pavel1269: well... if it doesn't know what you want in a way it understands it, then no
10:18	<LA[lord]>	i!i!wiki and !password seem a lot like #openttdcoop channel ones...
10:19	<Rubidium>	but WHY do you want to know where the wiki is?
10:19	<Rubidium>	it's in the topic
10:19	<LA[lord]>	spam and ham
10:19	<dih>	Rubidium: are you surprised somone wants to read it?
10:19	<dih>	:-P
10:20	<pavel1269>	what it will write to me for command OpenTTD
10:20	<pavel1269>	i just tried if wiki works ?
10:20	<dih>	http://supybot.com/documentation/plugins/
10:20	<dih>	there you go :-)
10:23	<LA[lord]>	hmm...that supybot site has half estonian interface too :D
10:25	\|-\|	skidd13 [~skidd13@p548A7561.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
10:26	<dih>	Rubidium: any better?
10:26	<dih>	http://pub.dihedral.de/openttd/r11778_reload_cfg.diff
10:27	<dih>	hello skidd13
10:27	<skidd13>	Hi
10:27	<LA[lord]>	hi skidd
10:27	<LA[lord]>	15
10:27	<@Belugas>	dih: settings.cpp, not aligned
10:27	<@Belugas>	view your diff, look at it
10:28	<@Belugas>	console_cmds.cpp too
10:28	<@Belugas>	openttd.cpp, some trailing white spaces
10:28	<@Belugas>	you don't know how frustrating those are while commiting :S
10:29	<+glx>	I know the feeling :)
10:29	<@Belugas>	lol
10:29	<dih>	thank you Belugas
10:30	<@Belugas>	i almost rejected last stuff from Sirkoz when it failed, so pissed off i was ;)
10:30	\|-\|	orudge [orudge@pc.lan.owenrudge.net] has quit [Quit: Goodbye.]
10:30	<dih>	:-P
10:31	<LA[lord]>	my gawd...whats wrong with me :(?
10:31	<LA[lord]>	I can't make any rail depots...not to speak draw beautiful things...
10:32	<peter__>	http://fuzzle.org/o/engines3.png
10:32	<peter__>	pom-te-pom
10:32	<peter__>	though that only means anything if you're familiar with newgrf sets
10:32	<Rubidium>	or know what peter__ has been doing lately
10:33	<@Belugas>	most likely the latter :)
10:33	<skidd13>	Rubidium: true true :D
10:33	<@Belugas>	in my case, at least ;)
10:33	<LA[lord]>	it's the UKRS set?
10:34	<dih>	how's that :-P http://pub.dihedral.de/openttd/r11778_reload_cfg.diff
10:34	<peter__>	some of it, yes
10:35	<skidd13>	LA[lord]: to be clear not only :D
10:35	<CIA-1>	OpenTTD: glx * r11779 /trunk/src/win32.cpp: -Fix: win32 compile failed. Also removed a duplicate include
10:36	<LA[lord]>	but.. two sets :S ...ahh I see ..It's peter_... a new patch?
10:37	<@Belugas>	dih, code style wise, i've got nothing more to say
10:37	<peter__>	3 sets actually
10:38	<+glx>	was about to say at least 3 (UKRS, DBSET, and probably NARS)
10:38	\|-\|	orudge [orudge@pc.lan.owenrudge.net] has joined #openttd
10:38	\|-\|	mode/#openttd [+o orudge] by ChanServ
10:39	<LA[lord]>	bah...I'm not very good at guessing what grfs might be in use :D
10:39	<peter__>	ukrs, canset and dbset
10:40	<+glx>	hey I was half right (it's an north american one ;) )
10:41	\|-\|	Sacro [~Ben@adsl-87-102-119-5.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
10:54	<Rubidium>	so when you say Czech railset and it is DBset you're half-right?
10:55	<+glx>	I guessed it from engine names
10:56	<+glx>	Czech one is narrow gauge IIRC
10:56	<Vikthor>	it is not
10:57	<Vikthor>	or at least it is not intended as such
11:00	<@Bjarni>	back
11:06	\|-\|	Dark_Link^ [~glidegame@fw.dormnet.his.se] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:08	\|-\|	\|Bastiaan\| [~Bastiaan@77.60.199.138] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 3.2.6 Anomalies http://www.kvirc.net/]
11:08	\|-\|	_Ben_ [~Ben@91.84.74.134] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
11:15	<peter__>	gah, hungry
11:19	\|-\|	icc [~icc@itth.net] has joined #openttd
11:21	<icc>	I just compiled on linux (with all req. stuff) copied files put when trying to start dedicated openttd just exits for no reason? help?
11:22	<skidd13>	icc: any output in the console?
11:23	<icc>	nope
11:23	<icc>	just $ ./openttd and then $ again
11:24	<skidd13>	any instances of openttd running?
11:24	<icc>	no =/
11:24	<icc>	I'm trying to recompile now without the prefix and dedicated options
11:28	<peter__>	./openttd -D
11:28	<peter__>	even a dedicated build needs -D, apparently
11:28	<peter__>	possibly something i broke ;)
11:29	<murray>	i was wondering about that
11:29	<murray>	-d did nothing :p
11:29	<peter__>	-d is debug
11:29	<murray>	then what is -D ?
11:29	<hylje>	-Dedicated
11:29	<murray>	oh
11:29	<hylje>	basically openttd with a null blitter
11:30	<peter__>	i can fix that actually
11:34	<murray>	how goes it icc?
11:34	<icc>	there we go
11:36	<murray>	:)
11:37	<icc>	:')
11:39	\|-\|	Gonozal_VIII [~Gonozal_V@N762P018.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #openttd
11:41	<Gonozal_VIII>	train 7 is lost, train 3 is loster but train 13 is the lostest by far
11:41	<CIA-1>	OpenTTD: peter1138 * r11780 /trunk/src/video/dedicated_v.h: -Codechange: When compiling a dedicated server build, select the dedicated video driver by default.
11:42	<peter__>	lostest? he
11:42	<Gonozal_VIII>	that's why i wrote that, wanted to use those words^^
11:58	\|-\|	helb [~helb@62.240.176.23] has quit [Read error: No route to host]
11:58	\|-\|	helb [~helb@62.240.176.23] has joined #openttd
12:02	\|-\|	glx\|away [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd
12:02	\|-\|	mode/#openttd [+v glx\|away] by ChanServ
12:08	\|-\|	glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:09	\|-\|	glx\|away changed nick to glx
12:10	\|-\|	\|Jeroen\| [~jeroen@d51A47061.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd
12:21	\|-\|	stillunknown [~stillunkn@82-171-87-247.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd
12:24	\|-\|	Arbitrary [me@morgoth.alfar.co.uk] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:24	<Gonozal_VIII>	pavels avatar always increases the time it takes me to read new posts... bad pavel
12:25	<LA[lord]>	:D
12:25	<LA[lord]>	gotta blame somebody for slow reading eh?
12:26	<Gonozal_VIII>	can't read faster while laughing :P
12:26	<dih>	purpose of extend_vehicle_life?
12:26	<LA[lord]>	:D...
12:27	<LA[lord]>	watch this avatar :D
12:27	<LA[lord]>	http://www.tt-forums.net/memberlist.php?mode=viewprofile&u=14268
12:27	<Gonozal_VIII>	dih... to avoid vehicle_resurrection
12:28	<dih>	?
12:28	\|-\|	frosch123 [~mtce@kolmogoroff.math.tu-clausthal.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
12:28	<Gonozal_VIII>	hehe yes, that one is good too
12:28	<dih>	nice avatar by the way
12:28	<dih>	Gonozal: it takes int's but what they mean?
12:29	<dih>	years to extend vehicles live by?
12:29	<Gonozal_VIII>	no idea? maybe a factor
12:29	<Gonozal_VIII>	leftover part from a daylength patch^^
12:29	<dih>	e->lifelength = ei->lifelength + _patches.extend_vehicle_life;
12:30	<dih>	that is in engine.cpp
12:30	<Gonozal_VIII>	straaange
12:30	[~]	dih snuffles
12:31	<Gonozal_VIII>	look where that _patches.extend_vehicle_life value comes from
12:31	<dih>	the config
12:31	<dih>	and it's not in the gui
12:31	<Gonozal_VIII>	config? haven't seen that line there
12:31	<dih>	settings.cpp
12:32	<dih>	line 1473
12:32	<Gonozal_VIII>	wow... it is in the config
12:32	<Gonozal_VIII>	extend_vehicle_life = 0
12:33	<Gonozal_VIII>	and it works..
12:34	<Gonozal_VIII>	but what's the point :S
12:34	<dih>	that is what i am asking
12:35	<Gonozal_VIII>	well... you can set it to 1000 and never worry about autorenew costs...
12:37	<dih>	max value is 100
12:37	<Gonozal_VIII>	ok... i tested it with 100
12:38	<pavel1269>	Gonozal_VIII: hehe
12:38	<pavel1269>	but i have much better ones ;)
12:39	<dih>	and?
12:39	<Gonozal_VIII>	[18:33:47][18:33:47] Guest2349: and it works..
12:39	<dih>	it add's 100 years to the engine's life?
12:39	<Gonozal_VIII>	all vehicles hat 100 years more
12:39	<Gonozal_VIII>	-t+d
12:40	<Gonozal_VIII>	not only trains, everything from rvs to planes
12:41	<dih>	updated the wiki
12:45	\|-\|	Brianetta [~brian@82-39-52-234.cable.ubr03.benw.blueyonder.co.uk] has quit [Quit: Tschüß]
12:52	<Gonozal_VIII>	hmmm why do i have stuff like daylength and seafloor in my config
12:57	<@Belugas>	looks like you're playing with too many patches ;)
12:58