| --- | Log | opened Wed Jun 27 00:00:17 2007 |
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| 01:05 | <Chris82> | good morning :) |
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| 01:44 | <Chris82> | hmmmmm |
| 01:44 | <Chris82> | I have fixed the cost estimation always 0 bug with the diagonal patch |
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| 01:44 | <Chris82> | but there is still a bug which is also in trunk |
| 01:44 | <Chris82> | the cost estimation is too high (happens with my patch, but it also happens in trunk) |
| 01:45 | <Chris82> | I don't know exactly how this happens since that bit of code is very rarely commented anywhere |
| 01:46 | <Chris82> | cost estimation for demolishing is correct, but for levelling a too high value is displayed |
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| 02:28 | <hylje> | desync bug in trunk |
| 02:29 | <blathijs> | bugger |
| 02:33 | <blathijs> | hylje: Any clue as to the cause? Doing anything special? Does the autosave reproduce it? |
| 02:33 | <Chris82> | http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=32698 updated with 1 patch and bugfixes :) |
| 02:34 | <hylje> | i dunno yet |
| 02:34 | |-| | Ammller changed nick to Ammler |
| 02:38 | <Smoovious> | Chris82... are you still doing INs? |
| 02:38 | <Chris82> | as you can see above yes :) |
| 02:38 | <Smoovious> | sorry, didn't know that was what you were discussing |
| 02:39 | <Chris82> | np :) I just updated the thread a minute ago with some fixes and code from the latest trunk |
| 02:39 | <Smoovious> | would you mind giving my FS#532 patch a try? finished getting it current to r10349 this evening |
| 02:43 | <@peter1138> | hylje: r10349 might fix it, but that's a wild stab in the dark |
| 02:43 | <Chris82> | oh that's a very nice idea :) this should be in trunk smoovious |
| 02:43 | <Chris82> | it always annoys me on my servers that chat messages are gone so quicly |
| 02:43 | <Smoovious> | I agree... :P |
| 02:43 | <Chris82> | quickly* |
| 02:43 | <hylje> | oo, timetables work rather automagically |
| 02:44 | <Smoovious> | I spent the past 5 days, incrementally getting it up to date... |
| 02:45 | <Smoovious> | now I'm restarting my bring_back_mail_subsidies patch from scratch, cuz getting my previous patch current would take a lot more work than just starting o ver |
| 02:45 | <@peter1138> | + SDT_VAR(Patches, chat_text_visible, SLE_UINT16,S,NC, 60,10,900,10, STR_CONFIG_PATCHES_CHAT_TEXT_VISIBLE, NULL), |
| 02:45 | <@peter1138> | chat_text_duration would make more sense? |
| 02:45 | <Smoovious> | I'm almost done, but something isn't working right |
| 02:46 | <Chris82> | true peter :) |
| 02:46 | <Chris82> | also I make absolutely every patch I add CONDVAR that highly reduces savegame problems |
| 02:46 | <Chris82> | even when using Flag S I often get savegame problems otherwise |
| 02:46 | <Smoovious> | yeah... I can make that change later... once I finish thtis one |
| 02:47 | <@peter1138> | this doesn't need CONDVAR |
| 02:47 | <@peter1138> | as it is all client side, in theory |
| 02:47 | <Smoovious> | well, I haven't done a patch yet that directly affects savegames... only c onfig settings |
| 02:47 | <Smoovious> | local configs |
| 02:47 | [~] | peter1138 > off |
| 02:48 | <Smoovious> | ? |
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| 02:51 | <dihedral> | mornin |
| 02:51 | <dihedral> | :-) |
| 02:51 | <dihedral> | Rubidium: SirkoZ sends greetings and says you're a king |
| 02:52 | <Smoovious> | peter1138... can I nest "? :"'s? like...: value = ( boolean ? ( x>4 ? yes : no ) : ( y>4 ? yes : no ) ); ??? |
| 02:53 | <Ev> | please compare this: http://paste.openttd.org/127with this: http://paste.openttd.org/128 |
| 02:53 | <Ev> | http://paste.openttd.org/127 |
| 02:53 | <Smoovious> | that equasion is totally stupid, but the syntax is what I am asking about |
| 02:54 | <Smoovious> | compare what? |
| 02:54 | <Ev> | 127 with 128 |
| 02:54 | <Smoovious> | ... |
| 02:54 | <Smoovious> | no |
| 02:56 | <Rubidium> | Chris82: the problem is that you can't properly estimate the cost of leveling without actually doing it, so overestimating is the best to do so you won't get a negative balance after leveling |
| 02:56 | <Chris82> | thanks for the info :) |
| 02:57 | <Chris82> | I have fixed all the bugs in diagonal levelling/terraform now :) |
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| 02:57 | <dihedral> | Chris82: well done :-) |
| 02:57 | <Chris82> | thx |
| 02:57 | <dihedral> | perhaps that would make it interesting for trunk - no? |
| 02:57 | <Rubidium> | hylje: what revision of trunk? |
| 02:58 | <hylje> | coop, 10343 |
| 02:58 | <Chris82> | nah there are patches used that are working but the code looks ugly if you know what I mean |
| 02:58 | <dihedral> | yeah - know what you mean :-P |
| 02:58 | <Rubidium> | hylje: then I suspect YAPF |
| 02:58 | <dihedral> | Chris82: you could tidy up the code |
| 02:59 | <Chris82> | I removed and changed a lot of stuff already, but I am no coding style guru myself :D |
| 02:59 | <dihedral> | Chris82: or perhaps TrueBrain would do that once he is back :-P |
| 02:59 | <Chris82> | also I am busy with uni stuff right now, so improvements have to wait till afternoon |
| 02:59 | <Rubidium> | hylje: and I hope it is fixed in the next nightly |
| 02:59 | <dihedral> | Chris82: you have an svn repository for the work you do? |
| 03:00 | <hylje> | Rubidium: well see to it |
| 03:00 | <Chris82> | uhm no? |
| 03:00 | <Chris82> | I download trunk with TortoiseSVN and have a few local repositories from which I make my .diff files |
| 03:00 | <dihedral> | right |
| 03:01 | <Chris82> | is that what you meant? |
| 03:01 | <dihedral> | yes |
| 03:01 | <Chris82> | hmmm I hate limes functions |
| 03:01 | <dihedral> | limes? |
| 03:02 | <dihedral> | the mp3 limes? |
| 03:02 | <Chris82> | when I have x^4 / something smaller for x -> infinity, can I say the function goes towards infinity? |
| 03:02 | <Chris82> | that limes :p |
| 03:02 | <guru3_> | tends |
| 03:02 | <guru3_> | tends towards to infinity |
| 03:02 | <oxygene_> | well, simple math ;) |
| 03:02 | <oxygene_> | l'hopital etc. |
| 03:02 | <Rubidium> | question is: are the "repositories" just checkouts of trunk, or do you have your own version management system behind those "repositories" |
| 03:02 | <Chris82> | x^4 is obviously bigger than (x^2 - 1) |x| but the problem is I may not think so easily |
| 03:03 | <Chris82> | we had some weird e^xxx limes instead |
| 03:03 | <oxygene_> | i guess math is kind of offtopic here =) |
| 03:03 | <Chris82> | Rubidium: I have no version management system, I only have a trunk checkout which I edit and update with trunk updates |
| 03:04 | <Chris82> | lol yeah :p but I have to do some math exercices for uni right now :D |
| 03:04 | <oxygene_> | i have my final exam friday, so i should stop chatting and start doing something for it ;) |
| 03:04 | [~] | dihedral nods |
| 03:05 | <dihedral> | oxygene_: dont bust a final |
| 03:05 | |-| | guru3_ changed nick to guru3 |
| 03:09 | <@peter1138> | Smoovious: "/me > off" means i'm not here :p |
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| 03:13 | <|Gekkko|> | look who the cat dragged in |
| 03:13 | |-| | |Gekkko| changed nick to Gekkko |
| 03:13 | <Gekkko> | dihedral. |
| 03:13 | <Gekkko> | lol |
| 03:14 | <Manslay> | i have a question |
| 03:14 | <Manslay> | why ottd shows negative profit for trains which transfer transit goods? |
| 03:15 | <dihedral> | whats up Gekkko |
| 03:15 | <Gekkko> | ih |
| 03:15 | <Gekkko> | hi |
| 03:15 | <Gekkko> | * |
| 03:15 | <dihedral> | hi |
| 03:15 | <Gekkko> | I hate Hannah Hoch. |
| 03:15 | <dihedral> | Manslay: searched the forums? |
| 03:16 | <Manslay> | nope |
| 03:16 | <Manslay> | just played the game :/ |
| 03:16 | <Manslay> | i'm browsing wiki atm |
| 03:16 | <Manslay> | :D |
| 03:17 | <dihedral> | http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=30098&highlight=negative+income+transfer |
| 03:18 | <dihedral> | http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=20710&highlight=negative+income+transfer |
| 03:18 | <@peter1138> | Ev: http://paste.openttd.org/129 |
| 03:18 | <dihedral> | ^^ might help |
| 03:18 | <Manslay> | thanks |
| 03:19 | <dihedral> | welcome :-) |
| 03:19 | [~] | dihedral has another 8 hours at work |
| 03:19 | <Ev> | peter1138: ...but with there was no duplication |
| 03:19 | [~] | dihedral is in need of sympathy |
| 03:19 | <dihedral> | :-P |
| 03:19 | <@peter1138> | what? |
| 03:20 | <Ev> | no triple duplication of code |
| 03:20 | <@peter1138> | you want it duplicated? |
| 03:21 | <Ev> | i want it be not duplicated |
| 03:21 | <@peter1138> | you have redundant checks for IsTileDepot() and is_new_steep |
| 03:21 | <Ev> | sorry :) but with marcos there was no duplication |
| 03:21 | <Ev> | lost 1 word |
| 03:22 | <@peter1138> | macros will NOT be accepted |
| 03:22 | <@peter1138> | the duplication was hidden in the macro |
| 03:22 | <@peter1138> | that is NOT good |
| 03:23 | <Ev> | then try this: compare http://paste.openttd.org/125 with http://paste.openttd.org/126 |
| 03:23 | <Gekkko> | dihedral: get a second job |
| 03:24 | <@peter1138> | Ev: try fixing the code instead of just rolling out the macros |
| 03:24 | <oxygene_> | macros are evil |
| 03:24 | <@peter1138> | also note that removing macros could well mean adding functions |
| 03:24 | <Ev> | C/C++ does not support local functions |
| 03:24 | <Ev> | and functions make code more complex then macros |
| 03:25 | <@peter1138> | # |
| 03:25 | <@peter1138> | etTrackBits(ti |
| 03:25 | <@peter1138> | # |
| 03:25 | <@peter1138> | le) == TRACK_BIT_LEFT ) || ( GetTrackBits(tile) == TRACK_BIT_UPPER ) || ( GetTrackBits(tile) == TRACK_BIT_RIGHT ) |
| 03:25 | <@peter1138> | not good |
| 03:25 | <oxygene_> | macros are not typesafe and a PITA to debug |
| 03:25 | <@peter1138> | that's all over the place |
| 03:26 | <oxygene_> | imho needing macros indicated a flaw in the whole design. one should fix the design instead of trying to hide the flaws by using macros |
| 03:26 | <oxygene_> | but then again, i'm not a dev here |
| 03:27 | <@peter1138> | oxygene_: you don't need to be a dev to be sensible ;) |
| 03:27 | <oxygene_> | i don't know what the "official" consensus here is |
| 03:27 | <dihedral> | Gekkko: why should i get a second job? |
| 03:28 | <Gekkko> | because you're lazy |
| 03:28 | <Gekkko> | "it will give you something to do" |
| 03:28 | <Gekkko> | "and stop you annoying me" |
| 03:28 | <Gekkko> | remind you of someone? |
| 03:28 | <Gekkko> | :) |
| 03:28 | <dihedral> | Gekkko: yeah right - me & lazy ! |
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| 03:30 | <Ev> | macro removes code duplication that functions can not solve |
| 03:31 | <Ev> | and it does not make debugging harder |
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| 03:32 | <Maedhros> | it doesn't remove any duplication at all, it just hides it |
| 03:32 | <oxygene_> | this is not true in my opinion. you can remove code duplication with functions too |
| 03:32 | <Maedhros> | and macros don't show up in backtraces, for example |
| 03:32 | <oxygene_> | if you think you can't, then your design is bad |
| 03:32 | <Ev> | it "hides" duplication as "functions" hides |
| 03:32 | <Maedhros> | no, functions (unless the compiler inlines them) only appear once in the compiled code |
| 03:33 | <oxygene_> | yes, and functions have the advantage of being typesafe, come up in backtraces etc. |
| 03:33 | <oxygene_> | so no advantage for macros here |
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| 03:34 | <Ev> | functions have redundacy of typesafing and arguments |
| 03:34 | <Ev> | you can not solve this at all |
| 03:34 | <oxygene_> | well, you can just code everything in main() |
| 03:34 | <oxygene_> | this removes al redundancy |
| 03:35 | <Maedhros> | and makes writing the program in C(++) pretty much pointless :) |
| 03:36 | <oxygene_> | macros that work an variable names are the worst |
| 03:36 | <hylje> | OO supposedly work to reduce redundancy |
| 03:36 | <hylje> | through inheritance |
| 03:36 | <oxygene_> | refactoring such code is a pain |
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| 03:46 | <Ev> | i dont see again with what are you going to replace marcos besides saying that "it is flaw in design" |
| 03:47 | <oxygene_> | with functions? with oo design? |
| 03:47 | <Ev> | it can not be replaced with functions |
| 03:48 | <oxygene_> | i just can't think of an example where macros would be _needed_ |
| 03:48 | <Ev> | any kind of redundancy |
| 03:48 | <oxygene_> | that is what functions and classes are for |
| 03:49 | <Ev> | marcos _are not_ function, hence it can not be replaced with it ))) |
| 03:49 | <oxygene_> | right, they are not functions |
| 03:49 | <oxygene_> | but if your code is not clear without macros, you should refactor it instead of "fixing" it by adding macros |
| 03:50 | <oxygene_> | i don't see any advantage of macros above functions |
| 03:50 | <@peter1138> | macros do have their uses, but not here. |
| 03:51 | <oxygene_> | yup, like DEBUG-macros are useful for example |
| 03:51 | <Ev> | macros does not needs any arguments what does not change, it is the advantage if use it as function |
| 03:52 | <Ev> | and argument is _anything_, not just a variable |
| 03:52 | <oxygene_> | but when they do not take arguments but modify variables for example, they hide things and someone who is not familiar with it doesn't see this modification |
| 03:53 | <oxygene_> | if you call a function with &variable you just see that it might be modified by the function call |
| 03:53 | <oxygene_> | or when you rename a variable you get strange errors, because a macro assumes another variable name |
| 03:53 | <Ev> | guess it does not modify it, only use |
| 03:54 | <oxygene_> | source code needs to be verbose |
| 03:55 | <@peter1138> | looks like we will not convince Ev |
| 03:55 | <@peter1138> | but also we will not accept those macros |
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| 03:56 | <Ev> | i wont fix it as principle )) |
| 03:56 | <oxygene_> | arguments are never a problem. if you have too much of them, wrap'em in a struct/class and suddenly you have just one argument |
| 03:56 | <oxygene_> | lol |
| 03:57 | <Ev> | you can not wrap some into struct if they of different kind, it may mix of any kind ) |
| 03:58 | |-| | TinoM| changed nick to TinoM |
| 03:59 | <Chris82> | Question: |
| 03:59 | <Chris82> | SDT_CONDVAR(Patches, finance_history, SLE_UINT8, IN_CHRISIN_SINCE(70), SL_MAX_VERSION, S, 0, 3, 3, MAX_HISTORY, 1, STR_CONFIG_PATCHES_FINANCE_HISTORY, NULL), |
| 03:59 | <Chris82> | SLE_CONDARR(Player, yearly_expenses, SLE_INT64, MAX_HISTORY * 13, IN_CHRISIN_SINCE(70), SL_MAX_VERSION), |
| 03:59 | <Chris82> | I have these two patch lines |
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| 03:59 | <oxygene__> | stupid internet connection |
| 03:59 | <Chris82> | it should not be necessary that this patch is made COND as it uses flag S |
| 03:59 | <oxygene__> | if you've said something, i've missed it |
| 04:00 | <Chris82> | when I make it non-COND no savegame will load though with obscure errors like too many EngineRenews or Gamma Error or whatever |
| 04:00 | <Maedhros> | yearly_expenses at least has to be saved |
| 04:01 | <@peter1138> | yeah |
| 04:01 | <Chris82> | ah ok so the patch does indeed store something in the savegame? |
| 04:01 | <@peter1138> | finance history doesn't, as long as yearly_expenses is not dependent on it |
| 04:01 | <Chris82> | then flag S was misleading my thoughts |
| 04:01 | <Chris82> | those lines are from the same patch so they are "connected" |
| 04:02 | <dihedral> | Chris82: what patch is it? |
| 04:02 | <Chris82> | I was wondering why the patch uses flag S anyway because the author says the patch stores the history for up to 30 years in the savegame |
| 04:02 | <dihedral> | ah |
| 04:02 | <Chris82> | Longer Finance History: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=21079 |
| 04:03 | <dihedral> | right |
| 04:03 | <Chris82> | I had removed it from my IN first due to savegame problems which I fixed now through making both these patch options COND |
| 04:03 | <Chris82> | but I've been told several times already that a patch with flag S should not need to be COND |
| 04:04 | <@peter1138> | yes. that assumes the original author got it right :) |
| 04:04 | <Chris82> | when I make only the Array COND and not the Patch VAR I get errors |
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| 04:05 | <Chris82> | I think the problem is that only the value how long of a finance history you want is not saved, but the history itself is indeed saved |
| 04:05 | <@peter1138> | maybe them both COND and remove the S |
| 04:05 | <@peter1138> | s/maybe/make/ |
| 04:05 | <Chris82> | which flag should I use instead of S ? 0 is wrong, since it's no server option |
| 04:06 | <Chris82> | and I tried N which made my game crash lol :D |
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| 04:07 | <Chris82> | let me quickly try something |
| 04:11 | <Chris82> | ok my mistake |
| 04:11 | <Chris82> | I can make the patch option itself VAR but the other part must be CONDARR because it's stored |
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| 04:15 | <Chris82> | Smoovious are you there? |
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| 04:15 | <@peter1138> | if finance_history is not saved, then you need to make sure that yearly_expenses is always the same size |
| 04:16 | <Chris82> | SLE_INT64, MAX_HISTORY * 13, < MAX_HISTORY * 13 is the size? |
| 04:17 | <Chris82> | 3 * 13 in trunk |
| 04:17 | <@peter1138> | ah yes |
| 04:17 | <Chris82> | so no matter if I set the history to 1 or 30 there's always 30 * 13 saved only not everything is displayed |
| 04:18 | <@peter1138> | right |
| 04:18 | <@peter1138> | that's good then :) |
| 04:20 | <Chris82> | http://bugs.openttd.org/task/532 this is a very nice patch smoovious made there, maybe somebody wants to get it in trunk with little modification |
| 04:20 | <Chris82> | I especially like the idea of chat text duration being seconds and not game days, integrates nicely with daypatch then :D |
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| 04:22 | <Smoovious> | ya |
| 04:22 | <Chris82> | I renamed visible to duration in your diff file btw |
| 04:22 | <Smoovious> | I'll be posting an edit of it by tomorrow |
| 04:23 | <Smoovious> | just changing the name that peter1138 didn't like :P |
| 04:23 | <@peter1138> | what is "line" ? |
| 04:23 | <@peter1138> | shadow line |
| 04:24 | <@peter1138> | ah, is that the mode where it only shadows up to the end of the line? |
| 04:24 | <Smoovious> | the shadow is the same length as the individual lines |
| 04:24 | <@peter1138> | right |
| 04:24 | <Smoovious> | not the full widtht of the chat box |
| 04:25 | <Chris82> | I think I put it in my next IN :) I really like this patch and I don't think there should be any complications with it |
| 04:25 | <@peter1138> | ///< added in r10254 by TrueLight |
| 04:25 | <@peter1138> | heh |
| 04:25 | <Smoovious> | yeah... I dunno what they were for. :) |
| 04:25 | <@peter1138> | don't bother commenting them then :) |
| 04:25 | <Smoovious> | one of my conflict-resolution builds had them missing cuz I didn't notice they were different when I resolved the conflict |
| 04:26 | <@peter1138> | the history will show it as him |
| 04:26 | <@peter1138> | hmm, time_t |
| 04:26 | <Smoovious> | well, I think that was more for me... planned on replacing them once I found out what their function was |
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| 04:27 | <Chris82> | time_t is a data type in C ? |
| 04:27 | <Smoovious> | could probably change <time.h> to a "time.h" but I have no experience with custom files |
| 04:27 | <Smoovious> | it has to be... I found it in the manual pages |
| 04:27 | <Smoovious> | :D |
| 04:27 | <@peter1138> | you can use _realtime_tick now |
| 04:27 | <@peter1138> | it is in milliseconds, i believe |
| 04:28 | <Maedhros> | Chris82: it's not a native type like int, but it's part of the C specification, i think |
| 04:28 | <Smoovious> | it came with vc2005 |
| 04:29 | <Chris82> | ah thanks :) |
| 04:30 | <Chris82> | I tend to program too much C style my tutor in Java Class said lol :D |
| 04:30 | <Chris82> | but that's probably because I only program C in real life and no Java |
| 04:30 | <Smoovious> | peter1138... if _realtitme_tick stops incrementing when the game is paused, then I'll probably switch to it... |
| 04:30 | <Smoovious> | I don't do java |
| 04:31 | <@peter1138> | hmm |
| 04:31 | <Chris82> | well it's the language we use this semester, it's a lot better than Haskell :D what we used before |
| 04:31 | <@peter1138> | why should change messages stay on screen when it's paused? |
| 04:31 | <@peter1138> | i know they do currently, but that's a bug imho |
| 04:31 | <@peter1138> | s/change/chat |
| 04:31 | <Chris82> | I agree with peter |
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| 04:31 | <Chris82> | a paused game shouldn't lead to "paused" chat |
| 04:32 | <Smoovious> | well, because the routine that checks for old messages, doesn't run when it is paused... |
| 04:32 | <Smoovious> | dailyloop |
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| 04:32 | <@peter1138> | that can be changed too :) |
| 04:32 | <Smoovious> | that's why I would change it if _realtime_tick only increments when thhe game isn't paused |
| 04:33 | <Chris82> | does anybody of you know the Better/New Graphs patch? |
| 04:33 | <Chris82> | http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=31984 |
| 04:33 | <Smoovious> | so long as it isn't running 200 times per second... it isn't something that needs to be checked more often than once a second |
| 04:33 | <Chris82> | I was wondering why some people have problems with badly redrawed graphics |
| 04:35 | <Chris82> | hahahahahahaha omg |
| 04:35 | <eekee> | visuals matter to some people *shrug* |
| 04:36 | <Chris82> | my dad just called me and asked when are you born? 2/9/1984? Which is totally wrong of course |
| 04:36 | <Chris82> | omg lol |
| 04:36 | <dihedral> | Chris82: never mind - my dad calles by my brothers name |
| 04:37 | <@peter1138> | 1982, i'd guess ;p |
| 04:37 | <Smoovious> | visuals can get to be too much tho... if it was a choice between nice visuals, and giving some up in return for better gameplay, the visuals are out the door |
| 04:37 | <Maedhros> | my mum and dad have been known to call me by my cat's name before... |
| 04:39 | <Chris82> | right guess and 9/9 not 2/9 |
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| 04:40 | <Smoovious> | ok, welp... I guess nested trinaries don't work, so back to rewrite... |
| 04:40 | <Chris82> | Smoovious: The problem with the Newgraphs patch is that especially Linux users (without DirectDraw obviously) have huge empty blocks in the lines with the graphs |
| 04:40 | <Chris82> | that looks ugly |
| 04:40 | <Chris82> | on Windows XP those bugs are minimal and on Vista they are almost vanished |
| 04:40 | <Smoovious> | never saw i t I don't think |
| 04:40 | <Chris82> | I just try to re-add it to the code and maybe fix some stuff |
| 04:41 | <Chris82> | but I can test with linux only at university, I don't have it on my home PC |
| 04:41 | <Chris82> | so when the graphs look perfect on Windows it means nothing |
| 04:43 | <Chris82> | how does Linux handle stuff that is handled by DirectDraw in Windows actually? |
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| 04:46 | <Smoovious> | welp... I'm crashing... dig back into my patches when I get up |
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| 04:52 | <Chris82> | uhm there are strings for Gold and Diamond mine in the default English file? |
| 04:52 | <Chris82> | do they exist in non temperate landscape? |
| 04:53 | <Maedhros> | the gold mine is an arctic industry, and diamonds are in tropic |
| 04:53 | <Chris82> | :) |
| 04:54 | [~] | Chris82 plays too much temperate |
| 04:55 | <Maedhros> | so do i :) |
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| 05:01 | <@peter1138> | Chris82: all graphics code is abstracted. direct draw is only used to update dirty rectangles from the video buffer to the screen |
| 05:01 | <Chris82> | was GetPlayerNameString replaced by something? |
| 05:01 | <@peter1138> | yes, it was spuriously named, as it got the player number string, not the name |
| 05:01 | <dihedral> | Chris82: play some desert games - they are fun :-P |
| 05:01 | <@peter1138> | use SetDParam(0, playerindex); |
| 05:02 | <@peter1138> | or something like that |
| 05:03 | <Chris82> | so SetDParam(2, GetPlayerNameString(p->index, 3)); will become SetDParam(2, playerindex(p->index, 3)); ? |
| 05:03 | <CIA-1> | OpenTTD: rubidium * r10352 /trunk/src/network/network_udp.cpp: -Fix: the network did not request the newgrf names of newgrfs that it couldn't find; it only wanted to request the newgrf names of newgrfs that where available locally and than were called "<Unknown>". |
| 05:04 | <Chris82> | 'playerindex': identifier not found hmm |
| 05:04 | <Chris82> | or should I replace the stuff in () too? |
| 05:05 | <@peter1138> | errr |
| 05:05 | <@peter1138> | no |
| 05:05 | <@peter1138> | SetDParam(2, p->index); |
| 05:06 | <@peter1138> | however |
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| 05:06 | <@peter1138> | however you've probably got p->name_1 as 0, and p->name_2 as 1 |
| 05:06 | <@peter1138> | so what you probably want really is SetDParam(0, p->index); SetDParam(1, p->index); |
| 05:07 | <Chris82> | this was the original code yeah: |
| 05:07 | <Chris82> | SetDParam(0, p->name_1); |
| 05:07 | <Chris82> | SetDParam(1, p->name_2); |
| 05:07 | <Chris82> | SetDParam(2, GetPlayerNameString(p->index, 3)); |
| 05:08 | <@peter1138> | *nod* |
| 05:08 | <@peter1138> | replace it all with those two then |
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| 05:10 | <@peter1138> | hmm? |
| 05:11 | <Chris82> | worked fine :) thx |
| 05:13 | <Chris82> | !invalid string id 0 in GetString oops |
| 05:13 | <@peter1138> | :o |
| 05:13 | <Chris82> | happens when the 3rd player starts |
| 05:15 | <Chris82> | my mistake works now |
| 05:16 | <Chris82> | forgot a letter that didn't show a compile error :D |
| 05:16 | <Chris82> | and the new graphs actually draw perfectly the bug that is happening is that when farm fields are painted behind the graph, the graphs becomes a little messy |
| 05:17 | <Chris82> | but I think the improved functionality weighs more than the graph glitches |
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| 05:25 | <Chris82> | hmmm I thought industries can't go below 32 prod anymore in latest trunk? |
| 05:25 | <Chris82> | I have a 24 prod industry tho |
| 05:25 | <@peter1138> | that was changed |
| 05:25 | <@peter1138> | as it upset some stuff |
| 05:25 | <Chris82> | ah |
| 05:25 | <@peter1138> | like oil rigs usually have very low passenger production |
| 05:26 | <Chris82> | but why is it that iron ore mines are by far the worst producing industries on average? |
| 05:26 | <Chris82> | coal mines for example produce a lot more on average |
| 05:26 | <@peter1138> | luck probably |
| 05:27 | <Chris82> | it can't be luck, I had 20 games in a row like this |
| 05:28 | <@peter1138> | coal mines start out with more production, i think |
| 05:29 | <Ailure> | yeah they do |
| 05:29 | <Ailure> | coal mines tend to go into a huge production spree |
| 05:30 | <Chris82> | yeah coal mines are always by far the best producing industries in my games |
| 05:30 | <Chris82> | which is a little unbalanced I think because coal is already the best paid good / cargo unit |
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| 05:31 | <Chris82> | oh damn half past 12 =O gotta go |
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| 06:06 | <Chris82> | http://www.sandra-bullock.co.uk/images/openttd/weirdbridge.png that bridge is a little misplaced :D |
| 06:06 | <Ailure> | well |
| 06:06 | <Ailure> | the AI lows elevated bridges I noticed too |
| 06:06 | <@peter1138> | hehe |
| 06:06 | <Ailure> | eh loves |
| 06:07 | <Ailure> | it's funny though |
| 06:07 | <Ailure> | it somehow manage to adapt some of the new features |
| 06:07 | <Ailure> | but in a such stupid way |
| 06:07 | <@peter1138> | that's because the old ai doesn't know it can link road pieces up to form networks |
| 06:07 | <Ailure> | yeah true |
| 06:07 | <@peter1138> | but it can build that bridge |
| 06:07 | <Ailure> | the AI reinvents the wheel |
| 06:07 | <Ailure> | every time |
| 06:08 | <Ailure> | when it comes to road networks |
| 06:08 | <Chris82> | well I usually don't play with AI anyway, I am only testing my patched version for long time stability :D |
| 06:08 | <Ailure> | I seen games where the whole center of a town is ruined becuse of a road-happy AI |
| 06:08 | <@peter1138> | "I've" |
| 06:09 | <Chris82> | btw on this screenshot you can see how nice the new graphs can look in Vista :p |
| 06:10 | <Chris82> | someone else sent me a screenshot from Ubuntu where that graph looked totally distorted |
| 06:10 | <Gekkko> | lol Chris82 is back |
| 06:10 | <Gekkko> | how goes "Found new town" ? |
| 06:10 | <Chris82> | :p not implemented at the moment |
| 06:10 | <@peter1138> | http://fuzzle.org/o/opengl13.png < smooth graphs! |
| 06:10 | <Chris82> | I'll give it a look now |
| 06:10 | <Gekkko> | Chris82: update it for the latest nightly at least for me |
| 06:10 | <Gekkko> | please |
| 06:10 | <@peter1138> | (aka blurry) |
| 06:10 | <Gekkko> | because I needs it |
| 06:11 | <Chris82> | peter: What town replacement set do you use? |
| 06:11 | <@peter1138> | ttrs3 that is |
| 06:11 | <Chris82> | hmmm let me check my version of TTRS because mine looks totally different |
| 06:12 | <@peter1138> | well the colour remapping is wrong there |
| 06:12 | <Chris82> | hmm 3.02a |
| 06:13 | <Chris82> | looks a bit like simutrans on that screenshot D |
| 06:14 | <Chris82> | btw... http://wiki.openttd.org/index.php/Enhanced_-_Graphics_Creation#Industries |
| 06:15 | <Chris82> | The authors are great artists and so, but I hope that OpenTTD will never look like this by default !! |
| 06:15 | <Chris82> | it would be like making Total Annihilation a DirectX 10 game eeek |
| 06:16 | <hylje> | a matter of style |
| 06:16 | <Chris82> | TTRS as default selt to replace graphics from the original game are great imho, this 32-bit stuff is not needed |
| 06:16 | <hylje> | yes it is |
| 06:16 | <Chris82> | I mean OpenTTD is no 3D Shooter for graphics freaks :D |
| 06:16 | <hylje> | better graphics make the game easier to approach |
| 06:16 | <hylje> | thus more potential contributors |
| 06:17 | <Maedhros> | i don't agree with that |
| 06:17 | <Chris82> | well but better is a way of view... imho TTRS graphics are much better than such 3D stuff |
| 06:17 | <Chris82> | these 3D graphics look complex and complicated compared to the current graphics |
| 06:18 | <Chris82> | I don't want to offend the authors in any way, they indeed look great and they are good artists but it's just not what I am looking forward to in OTTD |
| 06:18 | <hylje> | complicated? details? |
| 06:18 | <hylje> | you can just not mind the details, but i think details make the graphics |
| 06:18 | <Chris82> | yeah too much 3D detail is just distracting |
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| 06:19 | <hylje> | nope |
| 06:19 | <Chris82> | I play Oblivion if I want nice graphics or something like that |
| 06:19 | <Chris82> | in OpenTTD I want an entertaining simulation |
| 06:19 | <hylje> | why dont you want both? |
| 06:19 | <Chris82> | because if OpenTTD had Oblivion graphics I would sit on a hill and watch the game happening instead of making the game happen :D |
| 06:20 | <@peter1138> | hehe |
| 06:20 | <Chris82> | I know bad comparison, but you get my point hopefully |
| 06:20 | <hylje> | you can do that, but it doenst prevent you from doing stuff you do now |
| 06:20 | <Chris82> | Oblivion is a look and fight game, OpenTTD is a build and think game |
| 06:20 | <hylje> | high up camera |
| 06:20 | <hylje> | instead of first person |
| 06:20 | <Chris82> | yes of course it doesn't but instead of investing time in this I would use it for other stuff |
| 06:21 | <elmex> | openttd is a point&click game :_> |
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| 06:21 | <@peter1138> | investing time is not really a good argument |
| 06:21 | <@peter1138> | the people who do the 'other stuff' aren't the people making the graphics |
| 06:21 | <Chris82> | yeah that's true |
| 06:22 | <Sacro> | hmm, with timetables can trains wait at a waypoint? |
| 06:22 | <hylje> | i suppose |
| 06:22 | <@peter1138> | hmm, oblivion is pretty |
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| 06:22 | <Chris82> | yeah, but gameplay sucks :D |
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| 06:22 | <Chris82> | it's only nice to look at lol |
| 06:22 | <@peter1138> | :o |
| 06:23 | <hylje> | contary to popular belief you can have very nice graphics and very nice gameplay |
| 06:23 | <Chris82> | the first version was so full of bugs and the whole gui looks like a console game |
| 06:23 | <Chris82> | I don't want that on my PC |
| 06:23 | <hylje> | it *is* a console game |
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| 06:23 | <Chris82> | consoles are for little children :D |
| 06:23 | <hylje> | like the nintendo consoles? |
| 06:23 | <Chris82> | well nice graphics and nice gameplay in an example slightly comparable to OpenTTD would be Sim City 4 |
| 06:24 | <Chris82> | I really like Sim City 4 graphics so if OpenTTD would look a little like that I wouldn't mind |
| 06:24 | <hylje> | i recall most of the people playing them and buying games for them are 20+ |
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| 06:24 | <Chris82> | but half-hearted non-perfectly looking 3D graphics are no joy for my eye :D I am a perfectionist :p |
| 06:24 | <hylje> | sc4 graphics are very detailed |
| 06:25 | <Chris82> | Nintendo Wii is maybe nice, but look at a PS3, buying this is wasted money imho, you can get a decent PC for that price |
| 06:25 | <Sacro> | i do like SC4 |
| 06:25 | <Sacro> | yes, but consoles are the future D: |
| 06:25 | <Chris82> | yeah SC4 is a cool game |
| 06:25 | <Sacro> | everyone seems up on this "HD" idea |
| 06:25 | <Chris82> | well I'd prefer a laptop that has the power of my PC to a console |
| 06:25 | <Sacro> | but i've had 1024x768 for... 11ish years |
| 06:25 | <Chris82> | consoles are too expensive for what they can do |
| 06:26 | <@peter1138> | http://www.scan.co.uk/todayonly/ |
| 06:26 | <@peter1138> | rofl |
| 06:26 | <Sacro> | ooh |
| 06:26 | <@peter1138> | last item in the super savers section |
| 06:26 | <Sacro> | i might buy that wifi card |
| 06:26 | <hylje> | Sacro: ive been enjoying 1600x1200 for some years now |
| 06:26 | <Sacro> | hylje: yeah... me too |
| 06:26 | <Sacro> | i got a 19" tft back in 2002 |
| 06:26 | <hylje> | hd is overrated |
| 06:26 | <Chris82> | Nissan Skyline? lol |
| 06:26 | <Sacro> | though i'm down to 1280x1024 now :( |
| 06:27 | <Sacro> | hylje: 1280p would be nice |
| 06:27 | <Chris82> | hylje: I agree with you especially in the TV sector |
| 06:27 | <Sacro> | but anything less doesn't interest me |
| 06:27 | <@peter1138> | Chris82: innit |
| 06:27 | <hylje> | in the so-called console wars nintendo got it, everyone else just done past generation next generation |
| 06:27 | <Chris82> | I mean who of us can afford a good 1080p LCD TV :D |
| 06:27 | <Sacro> | ah yes, 1080p |
| 06:27 | <hylje> | a good 1080p capable display is about 700+ |
| 06:27 | <Sacro> | i was 4096p |
| 06:27 | <@peter1138> | a snip at £25,999 |
| 06:27 | <Sacro> | s/was/want/ |
| 06:27 | <dihedral> | Chris82: check out http://openttdlib.dihedral.de/example.sb.php |
| 06:27 | <Chris82> | 4096p ? what's that lol |
| 06:28 | <Sacro> | peter1138: WTF |
| 06:28 | <Sacro> | :o |
| 06:28 | <hylje> | of your |
| 06:28 | <hylje> | Chris82: movies are filmed at that IIRC |
| 06:28 | <Sacro> | Nissan Skyline GTR R34 VSpec Super Car T reg 1999 - 420BHP MINT! + Many Extra's - see specs - Limited Stock! |
| 06:28 | <Chris82> | 4096p ?? are you sure |
| 06:28 | <hylje> | yes |
| 06:28 | <Sacro> | Chris82: i think so |
| 06:28 | <Sacro> | something like that |
| 06:29 | <Chris82> | hmmm I thought HD cameras are 1920x1200 (1080p) |
| 06:29 | <Sacro> | ah |
| 06:29 | <hylje> | usually movies are filmed in the "next generation" of consumer tech |
| 06:29 | <Sacro> | UHDV 7680*4320 |
| 06:29 | <@peter1138> | "Notice to all Scan Staff - Not Available on Loan File for Evaluation or Testing in Technical Dept!!" |
| 06:29 | <@peter1138> | hehe |
| 06:29 | <hylje> | it's 4K for now |
| 06:29 | <Chris82> | dihedral: hey that looks nice :D |
| 06:29 | <Sacro> | hehe |
| 06:29 | <Chris82> | is the layout customizable? |
| 06:29 | <Sacro> | peter1138: i wonder how they'll deliver it |
| 06:30 | <Sacro> | i can't see DHL fitting that in a van |
| 06:30 | <hylje> | and for all you know, movie theaters push a bit higher resolutions than your basic HD |
| 06:30 | <dihedral> | sure is |
| 06:30 | <dihedral> | used HTML_Template_SIigma |
| 06:30 | <Sacro> | http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/57/UHDV.svg |
| 06:30 | <hylje> | Sacro: omg :D |
| 06:30 | <Chris82> | well I have a simple old 72 cm TV which can't profit from HD anyway |
| 06:30 | <Sacro> | 194GB/min |
| 06:30 | <Sacro> | uncompressed |
| 06:30 | <Gekkko> | scalable vector graphics make my pc lag |
| 06:31 | <Chris82> | before I buy anything like Blu-Ray (I go for HD DVD probably anyway) I need to wait a few years till I have an LCD TV :D |
| 06:31 | <hylje> | Gekkko: no, rasterization makes it lag |
| 06:31 | |-| | dihedral_ [~dihedral@212.126.210.227] has joined #openttd |
| 06:31 | <Gekkko> | no shit |
| 06:31 | <Sacro> | i have an LCD tv |
| 06:31 | <Gekkko> | i was talking about the format |
| 06:31 | <hylje> | yes shit |
| 06:31 | <Sacro> | well... |
| 06:31 | <Sacro> | LCD monitor with a dvb card |
| 06:31 | <hylje> | svg just makes it feasible to make huge images |
| 06:31 | <hylje> | try viewing a 7680 x 4320 png |
| 06:32 | |-| | dihedral_ changed nick to dihedral|laptop |
| 06:32 | <Chris82> | I have a 150000x30000 tiff here :D |
| 06:32 | <dihedral|laptop> | nice |
| 06:32 | <Chris82> | printed a banned on my dads plotter from that file lol |
| 06:32 | <Chris82> | banner* |
| 06:32 | <Chris82> | dihedreal: From when are those readings? |
| 06:33 | <Sacro> | peter1138: notice they can't pluralise tyre |
| 06:33 | <hylje> | printing works stuff tends to get crazy |
| 06:33 | <Rubidium> | :( my poor laptop only does 1920x1200... I want that biggest one ;) |
| 06:34 | <Chris82> | only 1920? how big is that screen :D |
| 06:34 | <Chris82> | my eyes would hurt after reading longer text at such a resolution |
| 06:34 | <Rubidium> | 15.4 inch |
| 06:34 | <Chris82> | btw Sacro, how does your Desktop look on the LCD TV? |
| 06:34 | <Chris82> | is it readable? or haven't you checked yet |
| 06:35 | <Chris82> | I don't have a DVD player, I have only my PC connected to the TV and sound system and on a normal TV the desktop looks ugly and unsharp |
| 06:35 | <Rubidium> | Chris82: for me it's readable... others don't always agree with me ;) |
| 06:35 | <Chris82> | hehe :) |
| 06:35 | <Chris82> | you have good eyes |
| 06:37 | <Sacro> | Chris82: its not a tv |
| 06:37 | <Sacro> | its an LCD monitor with DVB tuner |
| 06:37 | <Sacro> | oh, it might not be LCD |
| 06:37 | <hylje> | Rubidium: heh people say the same thing for my 1600x1200 15.4" lappy |
| 06:37 | <Chris82> | ohhhh, got you wrong then, at my PC I have an LCD since 2000 I think, but it's way too small to use it for watching DVDs or TV |
| 06:39 | <eekee> | hylje: I'm jealous :) |
| 06:39 | <hylje> | Rubidium: btw, what model of display you have? |
| 06:39 | <Rubidium> | model? |
| 06:39 | <hylje> | brand, model |
| 06:39 | <hylje> | out of curiosity |
| 06:41 | <Rubidium> | how do you get that from a LCD embedded in a laptop? |
| 06:41 | |-| | nihil84 [~paolo@adsl-ull-208-182.41-151.net24.it] has joined #openttd |
| 06:41 | <hylje> | a laptop model is fine too |
| 06:42 | <eekee> | I so want a 130ppi LCD. Not before openttd has greater zoom though lol |
| 06:42 | <Rubidium> | (II) intel(0): Manufacturer: LPL Model: 0 Serial#: 0 |
| 06:43 | <Jerub> | http://trinket.thorne.id.au/~stephen/money.png |
| 06:43 | <Jerub> | is that a known bug? |
| 06:43 | <Jerub> | I have >2billion dollars |
| 06:43 | <@peter1138> | nice |
| 06:44 | <Rubidium> | Jerub: what version? |
| 06:44 | <hylje> | eekee: this one's 133ppi |
| 06:44 | <eekee> | Ack! I have >8bil pounds in one game & dont' see that. Let me get the version # |
| 06:44 | <eekee> | hylje: sweeeet hehe |
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