TheGrebs.com:IRC Logs:#openttd:2007:04:18

---	Log	opened Wed Apr 18 00:00:15 2007
00:09	\|-\|	Desolator [Desolator@86.122.148.172] has joined #openttd
00:09	\|-\|	Desolator [Desolator@86.122.148.172] has quit []
00:33	\|-\|	Tefad [~tefad@c-75-75-4-250.hsd1.va.comcast.net] has joined #openttd
00:44	\|-\|	Ammller [~Ammler@84.226.108.255] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
00:48	\|-\|	KUDr\|wrk [~KUDr@195.39.113.200] has joined #openttd
00:48	\|-\|	KUDr_wrk [~KUDr@195.39.113.200] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
01:31	\|-\|	Tino\|Home [~Tino@i5387E928.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
01:34	\|-\|	XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd
01:38	\|-\|	ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-157-122.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ThePizzaKing]
01:43	\|-\|	ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-157-122.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
02:22	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9666 /trunk/src/smallmap_gui.cpp: -Fix (r9651): end of data / column flags were reversed
02:40	\|-\|	CmdKewin [~cmdkewin@212.243.72.197] has joined #openttd
02:45	\|-\|	CmdKewin [~cmdkewin@212.243.72.197] has quit []
03:12	\|-\|	Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0F879.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
03:16	\|-\|	Mucht [~Mucht@p57a0f8ed.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
03:18	\|-\|	Progman [~progman@p57A1CB0F.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
03:30	\|-\|	TPK [~jeff@c211-28-166-154.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
03:31	\|-\|	ThePizzaKing [~jeff@c211-28-157-122.eburwd2.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
03:31	\|-\|	TPK changed nick to ThePizzaKing
03:41	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@84.226.108.255] has joined #openttd
03:47	\|-\|	Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@galadriel.td.mw.tum.de] has joined #openttd
03:54	\|-\|	acerbus [~kreedovel@213-35-169-161-dsl.trt.estpak.ee] has joined #openttd
03:57	\|-\|	TheJosh [~josh@d58-105-163-46.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has joined #openttd
03:57	<TheJosh>	Hey
03:59	\|-\|	Sacro\|Laptop [~ben@87.102.9.203] has joined #openttd
04:02	<TheJosh>	Hey who should I talk to to try and get a patch included into the nightly trunk?
04:02	<Triffid_Hunter>	TheJosh: I'd find the bugtracker and submit your patch
04:02	<ln->	No one.
04:03	<Sacro\|Laptop>	i have a strange feeling of deja vu
04:03	<ln->	It won't get included. Just enjoy it yourself.
04:03	\|-\|	Osai^zZz [~Osai@pd9eb6bc2.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
04:04	<peter1138>	ln-, please kindly shut the fuck up
04:04	<ln->	peter1138: Sorry for being realistic.
04:04	<TheJosh>	Sacro: What time is it there? i thought i would try again
04:05	<TheJosh>	everyone was asleep last time...
04:05	<Sacro\|Laptop>	its 10:10 here
04:06	<TheJosh>	when are the most devels on?
04:06	<TheJosh>	or should i just wait a while?
04:06	<Celestar>	what patch are we talking about?
04:07	<Sacro\|Laptop>	:o zomg a Celestar
04:07	<TheJosh>	the cities patch http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=31528
04:07	<TheJosh>	makes some of the towns larger when you generate a new game. you can choose how many 'cities' you want, and how much larger they should be
04:08	<Celestar>	TheJosh: contact Maedhros, he's doing some work on cities, city sizes and city growth at the moment.
04:08	<Celestar>	he's not online atm but he might be later
04:08	[~]	Celestar goes back to work
04:08	<ln->	that patch wouldn't even pass the standard pseudo-Tron filter.
04:08	<TheJosh>	is he already making a cities patch
04:09	<TheJosh>	pseudo-Tron?
04:09	<Celestar>	TheJosh: dunno how much he has done
04:09	<TheJosh>	In-: Thankyou for your encouragement
04:09	<ln->	indenting with spaces, etc.
04:10	<ln->	TheJosh: don't take it personally. and if things turn out to be easier than i predicted, you can be happy then.
04:10	<TheJosh>	anyway, i have to have tea now
04:11	<TheJosh>	i will be back
04:20	\|-\|	setrodox_ [~setrodox@85-124-40-128.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #openttd
04:20	\|-\|	Osai^zZz changed nick to Osai
04:25	<TheJosh>	back
04:26	\|-\|	setrodox [~setrodox@85-124-40-128.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
04:43	\|-\|	Maedhros [~jc@host86-136-233-235.range86-136.btcentralplus.com] has joined #openttd
04:44	<Maedhros>	morning
04:44	<TheJosh>	hey
04:50	\|-\|	tokai [~tokai@p54b823cb.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
04:50	\|-\|	mode/#openttd [+v tokai] by ChanServ
04:52	<Maedhros>	hmm, bug 738 is interesting
04:52	<Maedhros>	it happens because IsVehicleOnBridge only checks at the height of the bridge
04:53	<Maedhros>	and EnsureNoVehicleOnGround only checks the ground level
04:53	<Maedhros>	but while a vehicle is on a sloping bridgehead it's not on the ground or at the height of the bridge :)
04:55	<peter1138>	heh
04:55	<peter1138>	is that one of the ones belugas changed? :)
04:59	<Maedhros>	yeah
04:59	<Maedhros>	so it's in -RC3 too ;)
04:59	<peter1138>	uh oh
05:02	\|-\|	Morphy [~morphine@193.220.103.232] has joined #openttd
05:03	\|-\|	CmdKewin [~cmdkewin@212.243.72.197] has joined #openttd
05:03	<TheJosh>	hi
05:05	\|-\|	CmdKewin [~cmdkewin@212.243.72.197] has quit []
05:09	\|-\|	tokai\|noir [~tokai@p54B823CB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #openttd
05:17	<Smoky555>	hi all
05:18	<TrueBrain>	hi TheJosh and Smoky555
05:19	<Smoky555>	i'm crazy, what's wrong? i get 9653 from svn, compile it in MS VS2005 without errors, make 2 folders with it, from first folder i run dedicated server, from another one i run client to connect to localhost and get an error "desync error" :(
05:21	<peter1138>	uh, cool?
05:23	<Smoky555>	server and client running without any newgrf files :(
05:26	\|-\|	DNazarov [~Miranda@80.69.148.14] has joined #openttd
05:27	\|-\|	Smoky555 [~Miranda@80.69.148.14] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
05:29	<DNazarov>	0.5.1-RC3 - works without errors
05:29	<peter1138>	there's at least one known bug :/
05:30	\|-\|	DNazarov changed nick to Smoky555
05:31	<Smoky555>	and .... ?
05:33	<Maedhros>	bug 738 applies to -RC3 as well as trunk :(
05:41	<HMage>	Smoky555: disable autorenew for server and client, as well as in running game via "patch autorenew 0" in dedicated server console.
05:41	<HMage>	it's a well known bug
05:42	<peter1138>	that shouldn't cause desyncs
05:42	<HMage>	I had those 8 hours ago on r9640
05:42	<HMage>	after disabling autorenew it didn't desync.
05:43	<HMage>	tho it's probably not the cause. the server was restarted too.
05:44	<HMage>	Smoky555: can you please provide the config file and steps you do to reproduce that desync?
05:45	<Smoky555>	"atorenew false" - in both configs. config files are default, generating with first run
05:46	<HMage>	does it happen on nightly builds built from the same revision?
05:46	<HMage>	try placing nightly builds into those 2 folders
05:50	\|-\|	Morphy- [~morphine@193.220.103.232] has joined #openttd
05:50	<Smoky555>	nightly builds (precompiled win32) works fine ...
05:51	[~]	HMage fires up msvc2005.
05:51	<HMage>	What revision you're trying to build?
05:51	<Smoky555>	9653
05:53	<HMage>	hold on
05:55	\|-\|	Morphy [~morphine@193.220.103.232] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:01	<peter1138>	gaaaa
06:01	<peter1138>	my computer's on a go slow :(
06:01	<peter1138>	at least putty is full-speed ahead
06:01	<Celestar>	peter1138: didn't you want to buy a new one?
06:04	\|-\|	Morphy- changed nick to Morphy
06:04	\|-\|	Osai changed nick to Osai^away
06:05	<peter1138>	Celestar: this is my work pc
06:05	<peter1138>	} catch (System.Threading.ThreadAbortException) {
06:05	<peter1138>	throw;
06:05	<peter1138>	}
06:05	<peter1138>	why did i do that?
06:05	<peter1138>	hmm, i guess i had other code there at one point...
06:11	<HMage>	Smoky555: sorry for the delay. Does the desync happen on a new game or on a saved game? I've just built from scratch via msvc2005 and started dedicated, no desyncs.
06:15	<Smoky555>	HMage : 9655 works fine. you can take my src-pack (trunk9653 with same patches) from http://open.ttdrussia.net/download/src_trunk_9653_rp.zip
06:16	<peter1138>	...
06:19	<HMage>	Smoky555: you have a daylength patch there applied. Did you try compiling without daylength patch?
06:20	<peter1138>	ah, so it's patched 9653? :p
06:20	<HMage>	there's also signal autocomplete patch. Try building without any patches, just clean trunk r9653
06:21	\|-\|	Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@galadriel.td.mw.tum.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:22	<HMage>	most likely the daylength patch is the cause. Since I don't remember that that patch was updated less than a few months ago.
06:23	\|-\|	setrodox [~setrodox@85-124-40-128.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #openttd
06:24	<peter1138>	# HEATWAVE
06:24	<HMage>	btw, peter1138, how about extending name_array to hold more than 30 bytes of data per line?
06:24	<HMage>	err, 32*
06:25	\|-\|	setrodox_ [~setrodox@85-124-40-128.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
06:25	<peter1138>	_name_array needs to go :)
06:25	<HMage>	away you mean? :)
06:26	<peter1138>	yes
06:26	<HMage>	how about a temporary fix, because it's unbearable to have only 13 letters for russian per sign.
06:26	<HMage>	some words won't even fit
06:27	<HMage>	like, "восстановление"
06:27	<Smoky555>	HMage : i have this patch, peter1138 is a author ...
06:28	<HMage>	Smoky555: try removing all patches, just clean trunk r9653. Build from that and see if you have any desyncs.
06:28	<HMage>	peter1138: daylength is your patch?
06:29	<peter1138>	no
06:29	<Smoky555>	peter1138 : yes :)
06:30	<HMage>	Unfortunately I have to go, I'll be back at around 16:00 GMT.
06:31	<HMage>	Smoky555: daylength patch was written by Sacro.
06:31	<HMage>	Smoky555: http://www.tt-forums.net/viewtopic.php?t=20006
06:32	<Smoky555>	grrr.... i speak about long russian names, not daylength
06:34	<peter1138>	heh
06:36	<HMage>	Smoky555: Ah. anyway, that code you sent me compiles and desyncs. Revert into clean trunk and see if you have any desyncs.
06:36	[~]	HMage goes away
06:36	\|-\|	HMage changed nick to HMage`afk
06:42	\|-\|	Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has joined #openttd
06:48	\|-\|	Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@galadriel.td.mw.tum.de] has joined #openttd
07:05	\|-\|	lolman [~lolman@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd
07:08	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@84.226.108.255] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
07:08	\|-\|	Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@galadriel.td.mw.tum.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
07:12	\|-\|	Celestar [~Jadzia_Da@galadriel.td.mw.tum.de] has joined #openttd
07:15	<Sacro\|Laptop>	oh noes, a lolman
07:17	<lolman>	lies :o
07:20	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has joined #openttd
07:21	<Sacro\|Laptop>	:o an Ammler
07:22	<Ammler>	?
07:22	<lolman>	Woah never realised Beryl was running so well :o
07:32	\|-\|	TinoM [~Tino@i5387E928.versanet.de] has joined #openttd
07:36	<TheJosh>	:)
07:40	<roboman>	(:
07:42	\|-\|	Vikthor [novotv6@pc304-23.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd
07:59	\|-\|	Vikthor [novotv6@pc304-23.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
08:00	\|-\|	Vikthor [novotv6@pc304-23.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd
08:04	\|-\|	Frostregen_ [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-133-147.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
08:07	<@Belugas>	Maedhros, peter1138: about 738, i did not ported my fix in 0.5, so it must be something else
08:07	<peter1138>	someone else did, i think
08:07	<@Belugas>	ha... could be
08:09	\|-\|	Frostregen [SADDAM@dslb-084-058-178-118.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:09	<peter1138>	r9584 \| truelight \| 2007-04-10 10:57:35 +0100 (Tue, 10 Apr 2007) \| 5 lines
08:10	<peter1138>	[0.5][0.5] -Backport frmo trunk (r9542, r9565, r9573):
08:10	<peter1138>	- Fix: when checking for no vehicle on ground-tiles, don't take into account vehicles that are in the air (r9542)
08:10	\|-\|	Frostregen_ changed nick to Frostregen
08:10	\|-\|	Vikthor [novotv6@pc304-23.feld.cvut.cz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
08:11	\|-\|	Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0F879.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
08:11	\|-\|	Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0F879.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
08:12	<@Belugas>	well...
08:12	<@Belugas>	another bug on my list then :(
08:12	<ln->	TheJosh: success?
08:12	<@Belugas>	i'm getting worse then bjarni :S
08:13	\|-\|	Vikthor [opera@pc304-23.feld.cvut.cz] has joined #openttd
08:13	<@Belugas>	shit!
08:14	<@Belugas>	i forgot my SD card at home :(
08:14	<@Belugas>	no work to be done today
08:14	[~]	Belugas cires
08:14	<@Belugas>	cries...
08:14	<@Belugas>	time for COFFEE!!
08:14	<peter1138>	get putty?
08:15	<@Belugas>	too much to learn in a simgle day :P
08:15	<@Belugas>	i should instead concentrate on work@work...
08:15	<@Belugas>	not been really productive lately ^_^
08:19	<peter1138>	feh!
08:28	<TheJosh>	ln-: There may be success, I am talking with Maedhros...a commit is on the horison
08:31	<TheJosh>	i think he has done more work on this then me though...
08:35	\|-\|	XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has quit [Quit: Solong, and thanks for all the fish.]
08:35	\|-\|	CmdKewin [~cmdkewin@212.243.72.197] has joined #openttd
08:36	\|-\|	CmdKewin [~cmdkewin@212.243.72.197] has quit []
08:40	\|-\|	XeryusTC [~irc@cc480157-b.sneek1.fr.home.nl] has joined #openttd
08:41	<@Belugas>	when the patch is good, when it adds something usefull, generally, there is an interest.
08:41	<@Belugas>	when it's a fantazy not taking into account the rest of the game, don't expect it to be in
08:42	<TheJosh>	yeah
08:43	<@Belugas>	for those who are frantically looking for patch suggestions, may i suggest to look at this ? http://nightly.openttd.org/devs/logs/docs.nightly.error.log
08:43	<@Belugas>	those are undocumented stuff, or stuff that is not doxygen compliant
08:43	<@Belugas>	lots of work that is (almost) garanteed to be commit!
08:44	<TheJosh>	patches that simply document existing features, etc?
08:45	<@Belugas>	yup
08:45	\|-\|	waxman [~cfluegel@static.88-198-83-123.clients.your-server.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
08:45	<@Belugas>	i've been working on clearing the list for a while
08:45	<TheJosh>	i have an idea for my next patch, what is your opinion. I call it 'Raised monorails' (although I will try to code generic)
08:45	<@Belugas>	but there is so much stuff to put in...
08:46	<TheJosh>	basically monorails (or other rail types) that can go above roads, etc, for use in cities
08:48	\|-\|	GoneWacko [~gonewacko@i157063.upc-i.chello.nl] has joined #openttd
08:48	<@Belugas>	would be tricky, i think... it will basically be like bridges
08:49	<TheJosh>	I dont quite know how to do them yet...
08:49	<TheJosh>	or if it would work
08:52	\|-\|	waxman [~cfluegel@static.88-198-83-123.clients.your-server.de] has joined #openttd
08:53	<@Belugas>	the idea is not bad in itself. just that technically, it would be hard to implement. not to mention the fact that you will have in fact 2 monorails : ground and aerial ones
08:53	<@Belugas>	if i may say so
08:53	<@Belugas>	would involves map changes, new graphics,etc...
08:53	<@Belugas>	but go ahaed. who knows :)
08:53	<Sacro\|Laptop>	hwo do you do a backtrace from a segfault?
08:54	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	use a debug build, and run that from gdb
08:55	<Sacro\|Laptop>	hmm, a debug build
08:55	<Sacro\|Laptop>	how to create that...
08:56	<TheJosh>	Belugas: I was going to make it just the same rail, but with a flag that tells it to draw a bit higher or something...
08:56	<TheJosh>	still working that bit out
08:56	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	TheJosh: you'll also need ramps and stuff
08:56	<@Belugas>	so it will look like floating??
08:56	<@Belugas>	you'd need poles, at least
08:57	<TheJosh>	yeah that as well
08:57	<TheJosh>	and ramps
08:57	<peter1138>	bridges
08:57	<peter1138>	basically like locomotion :P
08:57	<@Belugas>	indeed, that's waht i've said
08:57	<@Belugas>	well.. not the locomotion part but...
08:57	<Sacro\|Laptop>	peter1138: i have a memory location, in SDL.lib
09:02	<TheJosh>	do not worry Belugas, i will probably give up on raised monorails sometime soon anyway.
09:02	<TheJosh>	i just thought it would be a cool idea, especially in large, hard-to-get-station-into cities
09:03	\|-\|	MiHaMiX [~miham@xenon.bibl.u-szeged.hu] has joined #openttd
09:03	\|-\|	mode/#openttd [+o MiHaMiX] by ChanServ
09:03	<@Belugas>	i don't deny the coolness of the idea
09:03	<@Belugas>	just that the realisation would be... hard
09:03	<@Belugas>	to say the least
09:03	<TheJosh>	yes, i agree
09:04	<TheJosh>	just then i was playing with gui, and its annoying and messy, even to do somehting simple like add a single button
09:11	<TheJosh>	so Belugas, what do you work on the most?
09:11	\|-\|	TinoM\| [~Tino@i5387CF53.versanet.de] has joined #openttd
09:11	<@Belugas>	newindustries, doxygen stuff, making bugs...
09:12	<@Belugas>	and work@work too!
09:12	<TheJosh>	cool
09:13	<TheJosh>	im good at that last one.
09:16	<TheJosh>	is the openttd devel team looking for someone to reopen MiniIN?
09:16	<TheJosh>	perhaps with a slightly different structure?
09:17	\|-\|	hnsn [~hnsn@pc11-321-01.Student.hig.se] has joined #openttd
09:17	\|-\|	glx [glx@bny93-6-82-245-156-124.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #openttd
09:17	\|-\|	mode/#openttd [+v glx] by ChanServ
09:18	\|-\|	TinoM [~Tino@i5387E928.versanet.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
09:19	<@Belugas>	TheJosh : no, not really.
09:20	<TheJosh>	it wasnt working?
09:21	<@Belugas>	(most) users did not care of maintiaining their own patch, instable, confusing regular users as been a lab test for devs (which was never be the case), etc etc...
09:21	<@Belugas>	really hard to debug,
09:22	<@Belugas>	and... no
09:23	<hylje>	ottd totally needs a functionality plugin system :P
09:23	<TheJosh>	so where did all those patches we loved go?
09:23	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	hylje: you mean like newgrf? :p
09:23	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: maedhros * r9667 /trunk/src/ (9 files in 2 dirs):
09:23	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: -Feature: Add the concept of cities. A (configurable) proportion of towns can
09:23	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: start off larger, and will grow twice as quickly as other towns. They can also
09:23	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: be placed specifically in the scenario editor. Thanks to TheJosh for the
09:23	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: initial patch and the idea.
09:23	<hylje>	Eddi\|zuHause3: newgrf for code
09:23	<TheJosh>	like i really really liked in MiniIN the advanced ordering
09:24	<rane_>	why is it that you cannot change currency to euro during the game?
09:24	<rane_>	i find it wird
09:24	<rane_>	+e
09:24	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	miniin had some nice patches, but it was impossible to keep them up to date
09:25	\|-\|	Sacro\|Laptop [~ben@87.102.9.203] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
09:25	<TheJosh>	I will have to find some of my favourites, and bring them up or something
09:26	\|-\|	Peakki [antti@cs181000195.pp.htv.fi] has joined #openttd
09:26	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@adsl-193-46-fixip.tiscali.ch] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
09:26	<@Belugas>	rane_, it is possible to, if you write a grf file to change it yourself. otherwise, there is already a conversion system going on.
09:27	<@Belugas>	it just follows the rules....
09:27	<@Belugas>	look in currency.cpp
09:27	<@Belugas>	or something...
09:27	<@Belugas>	TheJosh, i can't tell you about the faith of those miniIN patches
09:28	<TheJosh>	the faith of a patch? huh?
09:29	<peter1138>	yeah, christian, muslim, catholic...
09:29	[~]	blathijs ventures Belugas meant fate, not faith :-)
09:29	<@Belugas>	oups...
09:29	<@Belugas>	yup
09:29	<@Belugas>	thanks for translating my mind :D
09:30	<TheJosh>	there were a few patches that made re-downloading the entire thing, everytime you want to play on the net worthwile
09:32	<TheJosh>	oh well
09:32	<TheJosh>	anyway, my patch (not really, better said my idea) is done, and Im off to bed. Thansk again maedhros for all your work, its pure brilliance!
09:33	\|-\|	TheJosh [~josh@d58-105-163-46.dsl.vic.optusnet.com.au] has quit [Quit: ahoy]
09:39	<peter1138>	a happy customer
09:40	<Maedhros>	indeed :)
09:42	<@Belugas>	NEXT!
09:43	<peter1138>	i need guinea pigs to test this cb36 patch
09:44	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	what is a cb36?
09:44	[~]	Maedhros raises a hand
09:44	<peter1138>	callback 36, used to modify some properties on the fly
09:44	<peter1138>	http://fuzzle.org/o/callback36d.diff
09:44	<Maedhros>	what can i use it with? ukrs?
09:44	<peter1138>	(missing bit is either saving or reloading cached var on game load)
09:44	<peter1138>	av8
09:45	<peter1138>	ukrs uses it too, but i don't remember any visible effect, heh
09:45	<peter1138>	in av8 it affects speeds
09:45	<Maedhros>	ooh, nice
09:47	<Ailure>	hmm
09:47	<Ailure>	I wonder where I should post a bug report next time
09:47	<Ailure>	:)
09:47	<Ailure>	Probably the locomotion forums
09:47	<Ailure>	they look nice
09:47	<peter1138>	yes, that'll do
09:48	<Ailure>	I wish I knew what went through me xD
09:48	<Ailure>	I used the flyspray tracker before, but instead I thought "durrr let's harass the GRF author"
09:48	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	i vote for alcohol :)
09:49	<valhallasw>	I vote for asperin
09:49	<hylje>	shrooms
09:49	\|-\|	Vikthor [opera@pc304-23.feld.cvut.cz] has left #openttd []
09:50	\|-\|	Kittysune [Gamefreak@194.47.44.229] has joined #openttd
09:50	<peter1138>	Eddi\|zuHause3: i'll whatever ale is on...
09:50	<Kittysune>	!logs
09:50	<SpComb>	Logs: http://zapotek.paivola.fi/~terom/logs/openttd
09:51	<Kittysune>	I blame caffeine
09:51	<Kittysune>	;P
09:52	\|-\|	Ailure [Gamefreak@194.47.44.229] has quit [Killed (NickServ (GHOST command used by Kittysune))]
09:52	\|-\|	Kittysune changed nick to Ailure
09:52	<Ailure>	stupid network
09:52	<hylje>	:o
09:52	<peter1138>	oh, it's you
09:52	<Ailure>	How are you gentlemen!
09:52	<peter1138>	so does anyone else want a go at the planespeed option?
09:53	<Ailure>	the current nightlies have the equilant of planespeed 4x on ttdpatch currently?
09:53	<Ailure>	At least that's the impression I got.
09:53	<peter1138>	not really
09:53	<Ailure>	hmm
09:53	<peter1138>	they're four times faster
09:54	<peter1138>	but it's done differently to how ttdpatch does it
09:54	<Ailure>	ah
09:54	<hylje>	ie. our planes go at 1:1 speed by default? ;p
09:54	<Ailure>	thing is that I managed to get ride of my TTD binaries with TTDpatch and all when I moved to my new computer
09:54	<Ailure>	So I can't really check
09:54	<Ailure>	(ironically I somehow managed to transfer the TTO backup I had)
09:55	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	hm, looks like i do not even have av8...
09:55	\|-\|	CmdKewin [~cmdkewin@212.243.72.197] has joined #openttd
09:56	<Ailure>	hmm
09:58	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	how do i set up a central newgrf directory that is used by all openttd versions i have?
09:58	<Maedhros>	symlinks
09:58	<hylje>	symlinks!
09:59	<Ailure>	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS_symbolic_link
09:59	<Ailure>	If you happen to be a windows user :p
09:59	<Ailure>	Not many who knows that it's possible on NTFS
09:59	<Ailure>	but it is
09:59	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	i am not... and i do
10:00	<Ailure>	heh
10:00	<Ailure>	but I suspect symlink is there to live up to some NIX standard or something
10:00	<Ailure>	and it's not implented very well or somethng
10:00	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	but wasn't the newgrf system supposed to do that without symlinking?
10:00	<Maedhros>	peter1138: heh, the planes in the intro screen are barely moving at all with your patch
10:01	<Ailure>	[newgrf][newgrf]
10:01	<Ailure>	L:\Program\openTTD\OTTD-win32-nightly_build\data\pb_viaduct.grf
10:01	<Ailure>	L:\Program\openTTD\OTTD-win32-nightly_build\data\pb_av8w.grf
10:01	<Ailure>	L:\Program\openTTD\OTTD-win32-nightly_build\data\basic_platformsw.grf
10:01	<peter1138>	indeed
10:01	<Ailure>	well
10:01	<peter1138>	because it doesn't update the cached values on load
10:01	<Ailure>	you can just write the full file path now
10:01	<Maedhros>	ah, i see
10:01	<peter1138>	Ailure: but the gui doesn't let you do that
10:01	<Ailure>	Is it really that hard to like
10:02	<Ailure>	do it on one GUI
10:02	<peter1138>	(cos the gui was written to understand a single data/...)
10:02	<Ailure>	then copy it over for the rest?
10:02	<peter1138>	no
10:02	<peter1138>	you're better off using symlinks
10:02	<Ailure>	reminds me I should clean up my data folders now
10:02	<Ailure>	heh
10:02	<Ailure>	well
10:02	<peter1138>	because it won't find them for network games either
10:03	<peter1138>	or even any games. hmm.
10:03	<Ailure>	I have five diffrent openTTD folders xD
10:03	<Ailure>	each one with almost same GRF's, but copied over the folders
10:03	<Ailure>	hmm
10:03	<Ailure>	thing is that windows can be confused with some NTFS features
10:04	<Ailure>	saw a hilarious screenshot
10:04	<peter1138>	well, at some point in the future i think you may be able to specify a single directory to use
10:04	<Ailure>	where it reported something like 1 TB used of 30 GB
10:04	<peter1138>	which'll do what you want
10:04	<Ailure>	it was just a file being linked over and over again
10:04	<peter1138>	heh
10:04	<Ailure>	well that does make sense though
10:05	<Ailure>	and the custom GRF's get's hard to differ from 'core' ones
10:05	<Ailure>	...unless oTTD also looks for newGRFS in subfolders
10:05	<hylje>	:o
10:06	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	it always looked into subfolders
10:07	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	i always had them in data/newgrf
10:07	<hylje>	does ottd break if i symlink into /?
10:07	<hylje>	or to ../ ?
10:07	<Ailure>	hmm
10:07	<Ailure>	I see then
10:07	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	i have no idea :)
10:08	<Rubidium>	hylje: yes
10:08	<Rubidium>	once it is out of memory
10:08	<Ailure>	guess that's a excuse to clean my newGRF files
10:08	<Ailure>	and sort them
10:08	<hylje>	i suppose
10:08	<hylje>	it's not a given to check for recursion
10:13	\|-\|	Ammler [~Ammler@84.226.108.255] has joined #openttd
10:13	<DaleStan>	Is there even any portable way to check a whether a FS recurses?
10:16	<ln->	what's a(n) FS?
10:16	<hylje>	file system
10:16	<ln->	are you sure?
10:16	<hylje>	rather
10:17	<hylje>	considering the context
10:17	<ln->	context = the irc channel for a computer strategy game
10:17	\|-\|	lolman [~lolman@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:17	<hylje>	at the moment context involves recursion on symlinking to a parent directory
10:17	\|-\|	CmdKewin [~cmdkewin@212.243.72.197] has quit []
10:18	<Maedhros>	ln-: that's more the location of the discussion than the context
10:24	\|-\|	helb [~helb@84.244.90.159] has joined #openttd
10:24	\|-\|	lolman [~lolman@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd
10:25	<eJoJ>	Hmmm, I can't start my ottd, it's output is "Error: Cannot open file 'data/srgw.grf'" what could be wrong?
10:26	<Maedhros>	wrong file permissions?
10:28	<eJoJ>	Same error with root
10:28	<peter1138>	clear out the [newgrf] section in the config, probably
10:28	<eJoJ>	nothing stated under [newgrf] in the config
10:29	<peter1138>	hmm, newgrf-static? clutching at straws...
10:30	<eJoJ>	static is also blank
10:31	<@Belugas>	<s>rgw.grf?
10:32	<eJoJ>	srssgw.grf
10:49	\|-\|	lolman [~lolman@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
10:49	\|-\|	Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl7-179-68.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #openttd
10:49	<Digitalfox>	Hi :)
10:50	<Digitalfox>	Hello peter1138
10:50	<Digitalfox>	Are you thinking of supporting "action 5, feature 0x12: aqueducs. " ?
10:50	<peter1138>	no
10:51	<Digitalfox>	no ? :\
10:51	<Digitalfox>	You don't like this feature?
10:51	\|-\|	lolman [~lolman@cpc3-leds2-0-0-cust55.leed.cable.ntl.com] has joined #openttd
11:06	\|-\|	Maedhros [~jc@host86-136-233-235.range86-136.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:07	\|-\|	hnsn [~hnsn@pc11-321-01.Student.hig.se] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]]
11:07	\|-\|	Osai^away changed nick to Osai
11:22	<@Belugas>	i am bored
11:22	<@Belugas>	to the point of boredom
11:22	<Digitalfox>	hi belugas :)
11:22	<Prof_Frink>	Do something then.
11:22	<Digitalfox>	bored?
11:22	<Digitalfox>	Play open
11:23	<@Belugas>	hello DaleStan
11:23	<@Belugas>	shit...
11:23	<@Belugas>	hello Digitalfox
11:23	<Digitalfox>	lol ;)
11:23	<@Belugas>	sorry DaleStan
11:23	<Digitalfox>	No work today?
11:23	<@Belugas>	Prof_Frink, i cant do any ottd stuff. Forgot my sd card at home :(
11:23	<@Belugas>	it has everything for ottd on it
11:24	<Digitalfox>	oh no... One mora day for newindustries :(
11:24	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	i take it your work work is very boring?
11:24	<@Belugas>	yup.
11:25	<@Belugas>	i have to schematize and analyse in full detail how the sku entry goes in our point of sales app.
11:25	<Prof_Frink>	Belugas: This is why you should do all development in vim in a screen session on a remote server
11:25	<@Belugas>	really boring
11:25	<@Belugas>	maybe...
11:25	<@Belugas>	too much stuff to learn on a single day :P
11:26	<Prof_Frink>	Vim is easy. :wq
11:26	<@Belugas>	plus, i'm working on WinXP. Means habits to change
11:26	<Prof_Frink>	Screen is easy. C-a d
11:32	\|-\|	TronBSD [~tron@p54A3D9AC.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
11:32	\|-\|	Thomas[NL] [~thomas@vdburgt.xs4all.nl] has quit [Quit: Ex-Chat]
11:32	\|-\|	\|Jeroen\| [~jeroen@dD5E03DCF.access.telenet.be] has joined #openttd
11:38	\|-\|	Tron_ [~tron@p54A3D858.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
11:38	\|-\|	BobingAbout [~BobingAbo@adsl-83-100-198-113.karoo.KCOM.COM] has joined #openttd
11:38	\|-\|	BobingAbout [~BobingAbo@adsl-83-100-198-113.karoo.KCOM.COM] has quit []
11:53	\|-\|	Osai changed nick to Osai^Kendo
11:57	\|-\|	Wolf01 [~wolf01@host231-235-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has joined #openttd
11:57	<Wolf01>	hello
12:00	\|-\|	Purno [~Purno@5357D37C.cable.casema.nl] has joined #openttd
12:05	\|-\|	Desolator\|Homework [Desolator@86.126.78.4] has joined #openttd
12:05	\|-\|	Desolator\|Homework changed nick to Desolator
12:11	\|-\|	Desolator [Desolator@86.126.78.4] has quit []
12:13	\|-\|	Desolator [Desolator@86.126.78.4] has joined #openttd
12:17	\|-\|	Desolator [Desolator@86.126.78.4] has left #openttd []
12:17	\|-\|	stillunknown [~stillunkn@212-182-130-7.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:19	\|-\|	eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-55.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has quit [Server closed connection]
12:19	\|-\|	eQualizer [~lauri@dyn15-55.dsl.spy.dnainternet.fi] has joined #openttd
12:19	\|-\|	stillunknown [~stillunkn@212-182-130-7.dsl.ip.tiscali.nl] has joined #openttd
12:20	\|-\|	buster354 [Desolator@86.126.78.172] has joined #openttd
12:20	\|-\|	buster354 [Desolator@86.126.78.172] has left #openttd []
12:22	\|-\|	Osai^Kendo [~Osai@pd9eb6bc2.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:25	\|-\|	Desolator [Desolator@86.126.78.172] has joined #openttd
12:28	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: miham * r9668 /trunk/src/lang/ (catalan.txt french.txt hungarian.txt korean.txt swedish.txt):
12:28	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: -Update: WebTranslator2 update to 2007-04-18 19:27:38
12:28	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: catalan - 2 fixed by arnaullv (2)
12:28	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: french - 2 fixed, 2 changed by glx (4)
12:28	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: hungarian - 2 fixed by miham (2)
12:28	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: korean - 2 fixed by darkttd (2)
12:28	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: swedish - 2 fixed, 1 changed by daishan (3)
12:29	[~]	Wolf01 nods
12:29	<hylje>	:3
12:29	<Wolf01>	i'm really bored :/
12:44	\|-\|	McHawk [~hawk@p5489CEBD.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
12:44	\|-\|	McHawk [~hawk@p5489cebd.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
12:49	\|-\|	raimar2 [~hawk@p5489d2b9.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
12:49	\|-\|	Digitalfox [~chatzilla@bl7-179-68.dsl.telepac.pt] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.78.1 [Firefox 2.0.0.3/2007030919]]
12:51	<peter1138>	har har
12:51	<peter1138>	no idea why
12:53	\|-\|	Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0F879.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
12:56	\|-\|	McHawk [~hawk@p5489cebd.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
12:56	\|-\|	Mucht_ [~Mucht@p57A0F879.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
12:57	\|-\|	raimar2 [~hawk@p5489d2b9.dip.t-dialin.net] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
12:58	\|-\|	dihedral [~dihedral@dslb-084-056-230-142.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #openttd
12:58	<dihedral>	hello all
12:58	<Wolf01>	hi
12:58	\|-\|	Vikthor [~Vikthor@212.24.150.226] has joined #openttd
13:00	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: belugas * r9669 /trunk/src/ (10 files in 2 dirs): -Documentation: some more doxygen fixes
13:03	\|-\|	BatchFile [~tleuser@ppp-58.9.161.41.revip2.asianet.co.th] has joined #openttd
13:03	<Wolf01>	i want to improve ships, anybody want to help?
13:04	<dihedral>	i give you ideas and you code - or were you thinking of something else? :-P
13:04	\|-\|	McHawk [~hawk@p5489d2b9.dip.t-dialin.net] has joined #openttd
13:04	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	improve what? usability? complexity? pathfinder optimisation?
13:04	<dihedral>	cpu load
13:04	<ln->	mobility on land?
13:04	<Wolf01>	i have the ideas, i can code, i can't do it without knowledge
13:05	<Wolf01>	maybe
13:05	<Wolf01>	(hovercrafts)
13:05	<dihedral>	what kind of 'knowledge'
13:05	<dihedral>	are you looking for
13:05	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	you might want to start with the water bridges
13:05	<Wolf01>	something more difficult than a "for" or "if" statement
13:06	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	i don't like the idea of hovercrafts
13:06	<peter1138>	hovercraft!
13:06	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	stupid language
13:06	\|-\|	BatchFile [~tleuser@ppp-58.9.161.41.revip2.asianet.co.th] has quit [Quit: ¡ÒÃÍÍ¡ä»]
13:13	<dihedral>	i am familiar with coding, just not c
13:15	<dihedral>	my packet just fell off the network stack
13:15	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	i am familiar with theory, just not with coding
13:16	<dihedral>	feed us with some ideas Wolf01
13:16	<Wolf01>	the first is "one ship per tile"
13:17	<Rubidium>	that's going to be very nasty in canals/locks
13:17	<Wolf01>	the second is "realistic locks"
13:17	<Wolf01>	the third "better pathfinding"
13:17	<hylje>	pathfinding that works at all
13:17	<dihedral>	what you thinking off for "realistic locks"
13:17	<hylje>	slow turning?
13:18	<Wolf01>	maybe
13:18	<Wolf01>	avoid 90 degrees turns sure
13:18	<dihedral>	looking at the size of a ship and that of a cannal: no turning?
13:18	\|-\|	setrodox_ [~setrodox@85-124-40-128.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has joined #openttd
13:20	<Wolf01>	Rubidium, if you plan to build a single tile narrow canal for double ways ship traffic you are wrong... you should think canals like track tiles, i think you don't use a single track for double way traffic and without signals
13:20	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: rubidium * r9670 /trunk/src/ (station_map.cpp tunnel_map.cpp unmovable_map.h void_map.h): -Documentation: add documentation to some the _map files.
13:20	[~]	Wolf01 should have dinner
13:20	\|-\|	Wolf01 changed nick to Wolf01\|AWAY
13:20	<dihedral>	hehehe
13:20	<dihedral>	Rubidium: quite true
13:21	\|-\|	setrodox [~setrodox@85-124-40-128.dynamic.xdsl-line.inode.at] has quit [Ping timeout: 480 seconds]
13:21	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	Wolf01\|AWAY: but you have no way of forcing directions on water tile, like you can on track tiles with signals
13:21	<hylje>	yet
13:21	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	so you can end up with 4 ships
13:22	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	-> <-
13:22	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	-> <-
13:22	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	blocking each other
13:22	<hylje>	canals might need signals
13:23	<dihedral>	yes
13:23	<dihedral>	how about a tool to draw a water route
13:23	<dihedral>	which would work like rail tracks, just not visible to other players
13:23	<hylje>	and make water routes like railroad
13:23	<hylje>	brilliant
13:24	<Rubidium>	Wolf01\|AWAY: well, in the NL they do run trains on single track without signals...
13:26	<Rubidium>	(something with maintainance some 4 weeks ago went horribly wrong and the signalling still doesn't work on that piece of track)
13:28	<Rubidium>	(oh, I shouldn't forget to tell that the maintainance was planned to take 2 days)
13:29	<dihedral>	btw guys, had a little odd situation today on one of the game servers
13:30	\|-\|	Wolf01\|AWAY changed nick to Wolf01
13:30	<dihedral>	one town
13:30	<dihedral>	2 facktories
13:30	<dihedral>	with the exact same name
13:30	<dihedral>	2 players delivering to one factory each
13:30	<dihedral>	but only one factory was showing the iron and the goods
13:31	\|-\|	KritiK [Maxim@ppp85-140-207-67.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #openttd
13:31	<dihedral>	sorry - the steal
13:31	<dihedral>	and the goods
13:32	<Wolf01>	[20:24:04][20:24:04] <hylje> and make water routes like railroad
13:32	<Wolf01>	i was thinking about using buoys and draw a thick line to show where the ship will travel, not the exact path, but neither the bird fly path
13:33	<hylje>	:o
13:33	<Wolf01>	locks should have signals, maybe you can place signals on them like on the tracks
13:34	<Wolf01>	and if you use 2 tiles wide canals you don't have problems with ships
13:34	<Wolf01>	i offten use 2 locks and 2 buoys to tell which lock a ship should take
13:35	<hylje>	:o
13:35	<Wolf01>	and the most important thing: rename buoys!!!!!
13:35	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	Wolf01: like i already said, you have no means to prevent 2 ships from driving next to each other
13:35	<hylje>	sea signals
13:35	<hylje>	buoys
13:35	<Wolf01>	yes, but if you have enough room it is not a big problem
13:35	<dihedral>	afk
13:36	<Wolf01>	is like when some newbies try to use 4 trains with a single track line with only double ways signals
13:36	<Wolf01>	they will get stuck
13:37	<Wolf01>	you have to transpose this think to ships
13:37	<CIA-2>	OpenTTD: peter1138 * r9671 /trunk/src/ (9 files): -Codechange: Implement NewGRF callback 36, which allows changing of various properties which were previously static. Vehicle max speed and train power/te/running costs are adjustable.
13:37	<hylje>	while you're at it, do the same for road vehicles
13:38	<hylje>	one-way roads plz
13:38	<Wolf01>	yes, this was another point i wanted to improve
13:39	<Wolf01>	but when i asked for help i got no response and so i left
13:39	\|-\|	HMage`afk changed nick to HMage
13:39	<hylje>	but do the boats first
13:39	<hylje>	boats are way more useless than RVs
13:39	<peter1138>	i had a patch somewhere to implement multistop for ships
13:39	\|-\|	Desolator [Desolator@86.126.78.172] has quit []
13:40	<hylje>	i think the most elegant way to do waterways is to have buoy-connected straight paths, also diagonal
13:40	<hylje>	the buoys could be double-way or one-way as signals are
13:42	<Wolf01>	Frostregen once did more docks per station when i was working with him at the distant join patch, but we never tried if it really worked
13:55	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	how about this: place buoys in between tiles, and reserve two paths between them, one on the right and one on the left
13:56	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	this would also mean, ships will not go "over" the buoys anymore, but actually pass them
13:58	<peter1138>	has to be turn on and offable, heh
13:58	<hylje>	ships would become ridiculously small then
13:58	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	hylje: what? there was no change in ships in there...
13:59	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	ships would still be 1 tile wide
13:59	<hylje>	ah
13:59	<hylje>	in between
13:59	<hylje>	that could work
13:59	<hylje>	if you mean the buoys would mark waterways much like railroad
14:01	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	well, i read the intention of Wolf01 as follows: buoys mark the end points of waterway segments, and the paths inbetween are fixed (automatically) as a more or less straight line
14:01	<hylje>	yes
14:01	<hylje>	i'd not make it too intelligent
14:01	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	ship pathfinding would then reduce to buoy hopping
14:01	<hylje>	and make it just mark straight lines
14:02	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	well, "straight" is not a very good concept in tile based space
14:04	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	you could say something like "max. 2 45° turns"
14:05	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	max. 1 should be easier
14:05	<hylje>	perhaps
14:05	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	but that might cause problems on canals/rivers with a lot of corners
14:06	<hylje>	people could be expected to put down more buoys there
14:07	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	yes, but people putting buoys on every 2nd tile could kinda defeat the purpose of simplifying things
14:07	<hylje>	thats their choice
14:07	<Wolf01>	docks might be handled like tracks with all track segments in one tile
14:07	<Wolf01>	*canals
14:07	<Wolf01>	s/docks/canals
14:07	<Eddi\|zuHause3>	Wolf01: i believe renaming buoys is just a matter of correctly handling buoy owners
14:14	\|-\|	MeusH [~MeusH@host-ip195-138.crowley.pl] has joined #openttd