TheGrebs.com:IRC Logs:#mythtv:2004:02:29

---	Log	opened Sun Feb 29 00:00:09 2004
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09:24	niqo	thor_: you forgot to add mdcapsession* in your last commit
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10:30	_Nero_	Does anyone know if there are plans to add internet radio to mythmusic?
10:36	mikegrb	yes
10:38	_Nero_	excellent.. :) Thanks mikegrb.
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11:02	Truin	well, this $5 computer ended up not being so bad after all... despite the problems others have had, I'm somewhat satisfied.
11:02	Truin	not sure where this supposed mpeg1/2 accelleration is, but, it runs mythtv, so I'm happy.
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11:16	TomW	is there a developers IRC for mythtv?
11:17	Truin	I don't think any are awake at the moment.
11:17	TomW	do they chat here or elsewhere?
11:17	Truin	here
11:17	Truin	isaac is in here a lot, at least.
11:18	TomW	there is an annoying bug in myth that I would like to get resolved and need some pointers as to where to look for the code it may be in.
11:18	TomW	k
11:18	Truin	good luck. :)
11:18	Truin	I've found some annoyances as well. Like, the inability to select Yes or No from the Mythtv exit screen. :)
11:18	Truin	and it only happens on occasion... really weird.
11:19	mikegrb	TomW: this is developers irc channel
11:19	TomW	when you edit a recorded program, then play it back, sometimes (most times) myth does not properly process the "delete from" marker and simply continues to play through that marked section.
11:19	mikegrb	best time is afternoon/evening us time
11:19	TomW	k
11:19	TomW	:) never knew a programmer that would watch a sunrise.
11:21	TomW	heh, I've enjoyed my myth box so much, I was considering adding another 250 Gig drive to the volume.
11:22	mikegrb	heh yes
11:24	Truin	I wish I had that much space... my tv drive is all of 30gb. :(
11:24	Truin	I'm very picky about what gets recorded, and how quickly it gets removed after being watched.
11:28	TomW	heh, yeah, I have a 246 Gig volume now and after editing some shows + marking them as "no delete", I am starting to get a little concerned about "free" space.
11:29	TomW	probably what I need to do is get the geforce card working, ditch the pvr-350 TVOUT, and get the DVD recorder working.
11:30	Truin	question about the pvr-350.... I know it does tv-out - is that just for mpeg playback, or does ALL video work in the tv-out? I.E., console, X, etc...
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11:33	TomW	Truin: yes, I have it configured as a 720x480 framebuffer for X, I can see the KDE desktop and invoke programs.
11:33	Truin	schweet.
11:34	TomW	I don't use anything but myth on it though.
11:34	Truin	cuz I got a 250 now, and I want a 2nd tuner, but that would take up the other PCI slot I have (only have 2).
11:34	Truin	so, I wouldn't be able to toss in a GeForce for video out, so, I want to use the PVR-350 for tv-out.
11:34	Truin	And yes, this will be a set-top dedicated MythTV box. :D
11:35	TomW	Truin: well, don't get too excited by the pvr-350, I am not satisfied with it. The one major problem is playing back DVDs. Using the patched mplayer, the sound and video do not sync up. I use an audio delay value for mplayer to sync them, but, the value changes for each DVD!!!
11:36	Truin	not too worried 'bout that. We have a set-top DVD/VCR combo... this will be strictly for recording/playing TV, mp3's, and the weather, browser, and gallery plugins.
11:36	Chutt	why the hell would you use a computer to play dvds?
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11:37	TomW	I bought a GeForce MX 440 yesterday with the intention of using the card's TVOUT to replace the pvr-350's in the hopes that by using accellerated X video I wouldn't be suffering from the variable audio delay problem with DVDs.
11:38	Chutt	use a dvd player for dvds.
11:38	TomW	Chutt: 'cause I don't have a DVD player?
11:38	Chutt	go spend $50 on a cheap one.
11:38	Chutt	ie, the same amount you wasted on a crappy video card.
11:38	TomW	bah! I have a Plextor 708A in the machine now, why would I need to put more equipment on the shelf?
11:38	Truin	oh, c'mon chutt... that's like saying "don't spend days setting up a mythtv box, just go buy a TiVo." where's the fun in THAT? :)
11:38	Chutt	no, it's not
11:39	Chutt	software dvd players _suck_
11:39	Truin	yes, yes they do.
11:40	TomW	I would like to get rid of the: music CD 5 cd player and the VCR in favor of a myth box, the goal was to add the box and also get DVD playback, record capablities. I am almost there now.
11:41	TomW	Chutt: actually, I don't see anything wrong with the DVD video I have now?
11:41	Chutt	you're blind, then.
11:41	Chutt	but, whatever
11:42	Truin	I guess it also comes down to the quality of your viewing device.... I could see how a DVD, played back software or hardware, might look the same on a 24" Sanyo TV, but look entirely different on a 52" 1080i HDTV.
11:43	Chutt	all you really have to do to see the difference is play back a scene where the camera pans
11:43	TomW	Chutt: yes, legally, I suppose that I am. Also, I do not have a high def tv either, so what is the difference? If I was running high def then it would be an issue, but not with crappy ntsc video.
11:44	Truin	vertical tears?
11:44	Chutt	naw, jerky video
11:44	TomW	yeah, it does do that.
11:44	Chutt	which is completely unacceptible to me.
11:45	TomW	I don't like the idea of the MPAA telling me how many times I could play a dvd though, I would rather keep the solution that I have and have the fantasy of some control over my entertainment.
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11:45	Chutt	nice spurious legal argument
11:46	TomW	shrug
11:46	TomW	I am also running an Athlon 2800 + 1 gig of DDR in that machine...
11:47	Chutt	what's that have to do with anything?
11:48	TomW	the video pans very smoothly, the only time that I see the "jitter" is when you have something like an animated sign (like for a gogo bar or something).
11:49	Chutt	that really has absolutely nothing to do with processor speed
11:49	TomW	so, I do expect to see an improvement with the geforce card as it will be using accellerated video, whereas the pvr-350 tvout is not.
11:49	TomW	no? rendering time has nothing to do with it?
11:49	Chutt	nope.
11:50	TomW	ok, then why do I need the drop frames parm when using mplayer?
11:51	Chutt	because mplayer is a crappy piece of software that has absolutely no code to attempt to keep jitter down?
11:51	Chutt	just a guess
11:54	TomW	well, I'll give the geforce card a try, I am not sure just how good it will work as the pvr-350's mpeg player is pretty good (fast). The audio delay is terrible with the pvr-350 + mplayer though.
11:54	TomW	you can set the delay value, get the lips to sync with the audio, then an hour later hit do a skip-back and lose sync.
11:54	cmorgan	how can you have ANY audio delay with the 350?
11:55	cmorgan	the card itself takes care of everything
11:55	TomW	naw, not with dvds
11:55	cmorgan	i have no noticeable delay when watching recordings through myth
11:55	cmorgan	so i'd imagine mplayer is the source of your delay
11:56	TomW	the playback of the nuv files is excellent, no sync problems, it only shows up on dvd playback.
11:56	Truin	have you considered a different audio sub-system? Like, ALSA versus OSS?
11:56	TomW	cmorgan: yeah, they split the video + audio streams.
11:57	cmorgan	isn't a dvd encoded in mpeg2?
11:57	Chutt	the 350 doesn't do ac3 audio.
11:57	cmorgan	ahh
11:57	TomW	Truin: yes and no, I had no reason not to use ALSA, just that I spent so much time getting everything else running. I am self-employed, so I had to get back to work.
11:57	Chutt	so you'd have to split it.
11:58	cmorgan	makes sense
11:58	Chutt	of course, it's basically be no effort to get things syncing properly with a little dev time
11:58	TomW	Chutt: yeah, the mplayer patch looked to be a quick hack.
11:59	TomW	I do a lot of embedded programming stuff, video / audio is a whole new thing for me.
12:01	TomW	<fantasy> maybe mythtv will become so popular that the demand for an integrated MPEG + AC3 + AUDIO + TVOUT solution will met by a manufacturer for less than $100. </fantasy>
12:04	Matt	almost achievable
12:04	o_cee	Chutt: did you you manage to fix the segfault?
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12:47	pcjabber	question in CVS -- how do you set the keybinding for the "PLAY" function? I dont see any option for in mythweb or the database
12:47	pcjabber	whoops, never mind
12:48	pcjabber	my fault -- was using an old copy of cvs...sorry =)
12:48	Truin	hehehehe
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13:44	pcjabber	anyone having trouble making mythweather from CVS?
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13:57	kvandivo	no
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13:59	tz-afk	ok the ringbuffer -- is it possible to set a start and endpoint in it and save that clip somehwere? i.e. you just watched a neat news article and want to save it
14:00	tz-afk	I mean I see that using the Enter key sets marks, but I don't know how to do anything with them
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14:06	_bitbyte	any of you guys know if an "RCA s/pdif conntoector" is the same as "Coaxial digital"?
14:06	_bitbyte	connector*
14:06	tz-afk	_bitbyte: yup
14:07	tz-afk	coaxial really describes the cable not hte plug, but in S/PDIF it's the same thing
14:07	_bitbyte	you're certain?
14:07	_bitbyte	ok
14:07	_bitbyte	i thought so
14:07	_bitbyte	but heck, you never know these days
14:08	_bitbyte	dfi makes a very nice ath mobo with spdif in and out onboard for 58 bux
14:08	_bitbyte	nforce chipset
14:08	_bitbyte	only needs a video card
14:08	tz-afk	S/PDIF has two connectors: optical and copper -- copper is RCA
14:09	_bitbyte	i knew the coaxial digital had an rca connectork i wasnt certain tho if it was considered spdif
14:09	tz-afk	yup
14:09	tz-afk	S/PDIF describes the logical protocol, IIRC
14:09	tz-afk	i.e. the 1s and 0s do the same thing no matter if it's optical or electrical
14:10	_bitbyte	well, thats what i tought, but it always pays to make certain
14:11	_bitbyte	tz, any experience with DFI motherboards?
14:11	_bitbyte	can you suggest any other motherboardds with dpsif in and out that doesnt cost an arm and a leg?
14:13	tz-afk	nope
14:13	tz-afk	I am using a shuttle x/pc right now
14:13	tz-afk	with a pvr350
14:19	pcjabber	question, in CVS, what does the DoPlay() function (mythtv/libs/libmythtv/tv_play.cpp:1733) do?
14:23	_bitbyte	tz, is there an economical way to convert from toslink to coaxial?
14:24	_bitbyte	poop, it's microatx
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14:28	pcjabber	question, in CVS, what does the DoPlay() function (mythtv/libs/libmythtv/tv_play.cpp:1733) do?
14:39	tz-afk	_bitbyte: yeah just tap off the ground and data line directly into the coax cable -- in all the stuff I've seen there are no secodary buffers or anything
14:39	tz-afk	the signal comes from the sound card directly to an RCA female connector, and then to the data line on a TOTX optical transmitter; that's it
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15:10	tz-afk	ok the ringbuffer -- is it possible to set a start and endpoint in it and save that clip somehwere? i.e. you just watched a neat news article and want to save it
15:10	tz-afk	I mean I see that using the Enter key sets marks, but I don't know how to do anything with them
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15:43	niqo	thor_: oh, but then mfdinstance.h should not be installed..
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15:47	thor_	yup
15:47	thor_	well, only interface, not instance)
15:48	thor_	it's out in my tree, will come in on the next commit
15:49	niqo	<niqo> thor_: you forgot to add mdcapsession* in your last commit
15:49	niqo	dunno if you saw it
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15:51	thor_	oops
15:51	thor_	thanks
15:51	thor_	too many things to keep of track of :-)
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16:25	thor_	Heh, another prediction correct: http://crazney.net/programs/itunes/authentication.html
16:25	thor_	Chutt, we have problems with using that code, or do we want to try and dynamically link to his lib
16:25	thor_	?
16:26	thor_	(a la decss?)
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16:31	psychy	hi, dunno if this channel is appropriate, but here goes. i'm emerging myth tv on a gentoo system. and dev-perl/libwww-perl-5.69-r2 is failing.
16:31	psychy	i'm not sure how to get round it
16:32	Captain_Murdo	\| might get a quicker answer in #mythtv-users
16:32	psychy	thanks. i've asked the same in there.
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16:37	Sir-Al	feature request: playlists for mythvideo
16:37	thor_	you can already build chain of files to play in mythvideo
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16:44	dataworm	is there a quick way to fix the Zip/Postal Code in the configuration so that it would accept Canada Postal Code... XMLTV do accept it but Mythtv just refuse to let me enter it... Instead of 5 digit, the format is X9X9X9
16:46	Captain_Murdo	\| thought that was fixed a long time ago.
16:47	Captain_Murdo	\| are you entering a space or not? maybe try the opposite.
16:47	dataworm	really.. I must be out of date then :(
16:47	Captain_Murdo	\| I mean like a year so unless you're running 0.7 or so. :)
16:48	dataworm	Captain_Murdoch : I guess I typed a space... and that what fucked up
16:48	dataworm	thanks for your the hint :)
16:48		* mikegrb gives Captain_Murdoch a cupcake
16:49	thor_	H0H 0HO
16:49		* Captain_Murd swallows it whole
16:49	mikegrb	4~
16:49	dataworm	workind well now :)
16:49	dataworm	thanks
16:50	dataworm	So used to get software/website that screw this, than the first reflex is to think it's screwed
16:51	Captain_Murdo	\| myth has developers in quite a few countries and I think several who submit patches are from Canada.
16:53	dataworm	Is there way to tell XFree86 to not use part of the screen? I am using a HDTV Rear Projection TV and I loose some of the space, I know I can fix that space area in mythtv, but it's still annoying for other software...
16:54	dataworm	I guess many of you went thru the same issues
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17:20	mdz	is transcoding in mythbackend supposed to work?
17:20	thor_	cvs ?
17:20	thor_	works here on 0.14
17:20	mdz	0.14
17:20	thor_	PVR-x50 to mjpeg
17:20	mdz	I just want to trim stuff I've marked in a cutlist
17:20	mdz	2004-02-29 14:16:08 Transcoding from /var/lib/mythtv/2268_20040221204400_20040221222000.nuv to /var/lib/mythtv/2268_20040221204400_20040221222000.nuv.tmp
17:20	mdz	Unknown video codec: 2004-02-29 14:16:08 Fast-Forwarding from 0 to 23940
17:21	thor_	don't think same format (just cutlist removal) is working
17:21	mdz	ah
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17:54	G-funk\|laptop	\| !recap
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18:19	Sir-Al	!recap
18:24	sfr	recap!
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19:28	rkulagow	i wonder how many of the schemes to get around the 2 second live tv delay will net any code changes.
19:29	thor_	110 channels, 110 hw encoders, it's the only solution !
19:29	billytwowilly	\| heh.
19:30	rkulagow	yeah, but there is still going to be a _2 second delay_ between live tv and what we're watching.
19:30	rkulagow	that would make me nuts!
19:30	rkulagow	also, can i synchronize the audio and video between multiple frontends so that i can watch the same program as i move from room to room?
19:31	billytwowilly	\| heh. I just thought of the solution to the 2 second problem.
19:32	billytwowilly	\| start off by playing direct from the tv tuner card to the screen and then insert extra frames until you have 2 seconds buffer. do that over a minute or so.
19:32		* billytwowill waits to be told he's dumb.
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19:33	thor_	and I want live tv playlists !
19:34	billytwowilly	\| live tv playlists?
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19:34	thor_	yeah, watch channel 3 for 6 seconds, then channel 2 for 1 minute, that'd be righteous
19:34	billytwowilly	\| oh.. heh..
19:35	billytwowilly	\| that's worse than my fix for the 2 second wait;)
19:37		* billytwowill goes to read the mythtv-users mailing list archives.
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19:51	pigeon	hi
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20:49	Chutt	Our goal here is to provide a better way than scraping for the open-source community (and other miscellaneous freeware types) to get television listings data for North America.
20:49	Chutt	heh
20:49	Chutt	This isn't a beta test. This is the real thing.
20:49	Chutt	What we intend is that when you start distributing your software to the masses (assuming you do this in a non-commercial manner), you'll also give your users instructions on how to sign up for a data feed from Zap2it Labs, using the certificate code we've given you.
20:53	Chutt	very interestink.
20:53	Chutt	someone needs to write that translator =)
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21:07	Chutt	anyone played with david's new scheduler?
21:07	cmorgan	quiet tonight it seems
21:09	jams	Chutt, just compiled it, now I need to wait for the wife to go to bed.
21:10	jams	With the oscars on that could be a while
21:27	kvandivo	i've updated cvs with it.. i turned on the 'record higher priority items later if a lower priority item needs to be scheduled now'
21:28	kvandivo	haven't had much opportunity to "play" with it, though..
21:28	kvandivo	i added a second tuner to my master backend and have been trying to track down strange moire type patterns that i have on both feeds now
21:29		* mikegrb moires kvandivo
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21:34	davatar	crap.. I probably should have realized mythweb is still protocol 3 before I upgraded :(
21:38	mdz	Chutt: more A/V sync talk on theora-dev
21:38	mdz	more claims from the xiph guys that it is someone else's problem
21:38	mdz	in other news, Theora still not being used for anything anywhere
21:46	Chutt	kvandivo, ah
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21:49	mdz	Chutt: so I finally found what was causing that long-standing audio weirdness of mine
21:49	Chutt	yeah, saw your commit
21:49	mdz	Chutt: do you happen to remember why that code was there in the first place? it seems to predate the current edition of the CVS repository
21:50	Chutt	probably came from the original nuppelvideo codec
21:52	Chutt	glad it's fixed =)
21:55	mdz	it was making me crazy
21:55	mdz	the last straw was when I tried to record something, and it got the wrong audio channel, and I rescheduled it, and it happened again
21:56	Chutt	mdz, did you see the post to the zap2it forums i was quoting from above?
21:57	mdz	Chutt: no, but I saw your quote
21:57	Chutt	there was more, but that was the gist of it
21:57	mdz	no pun intended
21:57	Chutt	heh
21:59	Chutt	oh well
21:59	mdz	I got as far as using their sample Perl grabber to pull down some sample listings
21:59	mdz	sure is fast
21:59	Chutt	i'm officially unemployed in a few hours
21:59	Chutt	maybe i'll feel like working on support for it, now that i have more time
21:59	mdz	any prospects?
21:59	Chutt	haven't looked at all
21:59	Chutt	last couple weeks were really busy
22:00	Chutt	company wants to keep me on on a consulting basis while they can, though
22:01	Chutt	i should find something else, though
22:02	Chutt	heh
22:02	Chutt	there's a vbscript-based grabber in their forums
22:02	Chutt	doesn't use a soap lib, just http
22:04	mdz	how do you think it makes sense to split things up now that there can be multiple formats for program data?
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22:05	Chutt	well, probably could split the 'call xmltv and parse it into an internal structure' bits of filldata.cpp into a separate file
22:06	Chutt	then do the 'call dd grabber and parse it into an internal structure' in another file
22:06	Chutt	that'd leave all the upper level logic in filldata.cpp
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22:07	mdz	I'm thinking it'd probably be good to make classes for the grabbers at this point
22:07	mdz	so they look more or less the same to filldata
22:07	Chutt	eh
22:07	Chutt	could
22:07	mdz	and move all of that logic out of filldata
22:07	mdz	there's a lot of (if grabber == blahblah) big switch statements
22:07	Chutt	there's only ever going to be a couple of these, though
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22:07	mdz	even the existing xmltv ones could benefit
22:08	Chutt	i think making classes would make it a little less obvious as to how to add new ones
22:08	Chutt	since a bunch of em act very similarly
22:09	Chutt	and all of that is just building the command line and deciding how much data to grab
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22:44	stevenm	Hi all
22:44	stevenm	I have a very strange problem
22:45	stevenm	I just reinstalled Gentoo, and when I use tvtime, I get these strange noise lines in the picture. Other tv programs do not have this problem
22:45	stevenm	The noise looks like sparse black lines starting in the middle of the image and heading horizontally outward.
22:46	stevenm	Has anyone ever had such a problem and can recommend a fix?
22:52	mikegrb	hey stevenm
22:52	mikegrb	guess what?
22:52	stevenm	mikegrb, what ?
22:52	mikegrb	this is #mythtv not #tvtime, it is a channel for discussing development of mythtv, it isn't even for mythtv user support
22:53	stevenm	well, then, care to point me to a more appropriate place?
22:53	stevenm	I tried all the usual things, stfw until the cows come home, #tvtime, all that
22:53	stevenm	besides, mythtv uses tvtime, so I figured someone here would know
22:53	stevenm	if nowhere else
22:54	mikegrb	well #mythtv is certainly not an appropriate place and mythtv doesn't use tvtime
22:54	-!-	Irssi: #mythtv: Total of 63 nicks 0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 63 normal
22:54	stevenm	damn controller card died on hd, all is lost, just trying to get everything working again..
22:54	stevenm	sorry.
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22:54	mikegrb	bye bye
22:55	mikegrb	maybe I should be nicer sometimes
22:55	mikegrb	oh well
23:27	Chutt	nicer?
23:27	cmorgan	heh
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23:28	cmorgan	being nice is usually good for everyone involved ;-)
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23:41		* Captain_Murd kicks both fvwm2 and x-chat for whichever one of them causes x-chat to close whenever he reloads his fvwm config.
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23:49	Morph	Captain_Murdoch: hey.
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---	Log	closed Mon Mar 01 00:00:54 2004