TheGrebs.com:IRC Logs:#mythtv:2002:11:09

07:10	--> You	are now talking on #mythtv
07:10	-!-	Topic for #mythtv is http://www.mythtv.org/ -- The Cheap(est), High-Quality Alternative
07:10	-!-	Topic for #mythtv set by Soopaman at Thu Nov 7 15:43:57
07:56	-!-	s3fudi [~fabiano@RJ231231.user.veloxzone.com.br] has joined #mythtv
08:21	<s3fudi>	guys.. what do you think is a better card.. pixelview playtv pro, pinnacle studio pctv or the hauppage wintv go pci ?
08:21	<s3fudi>	or does it depend solely on the chip (all use bt878)?
09:21	-!-	vektor [] has quit ["ugh"]
10:48	<Chutt>	wow, dumb people on the mailing list
11:30	-!-	rcaskey [~rcaskey@adsl-156-81-224.asm.bellsouth.net] has joined #mythtv
11:32	<mdz_>	Chutt: want to test some debs?
11:33	-!-	Universe [~Yeah@6532175hfc29.tampabay.rr.com] has joined #mythtv
11:34	<mdz_>	Chutt: re: mailing list, that's what you get for becoming popular :-P
11:35	-!-	vektor [~vektor@cauchy.theorem.ca] has joined #mythtv
11:36	<Chutt>	heh
11:36	<Chutt>	sure, i'll test some debs
11:36	<Chutt>	heh
11:36	<rcaskey>	woot :)
11:36	<Chutt>	yet another clueless SACD FUD article on /.
11:36	<Chutt>	the guy that wants volume controls just wants me to add system() calls to amixer.
11:37	<vektor>	cute :/
11:37	<mdz_>	heh, I think a full 3/5 of that guy's questions are either answered in the FAQ or the install docs
11:37	<Chutt>	all of them are
11:37	<Chutt>	and i'm not even going to bother with the guy that upgraded his system and now mythtv locks up
11:37	<mdz_>	even the twig module not installing?
11:37	<Chutt>	yeah, that's on the website faq
11:38	<mdz_>	Chutt: no, that guy is fine, he is going to use gdb
11:38	<mdz_>	Chutt: while his system is hung
11:38	<Chutt>	exactly
11:38	<Chutt>	i also just got an email asking how to run the setup program
11:38	<mdz_>	oh, is that a "you didn't install the prerequisites"?
11:38	<Chutt>	i don't know
11:38	<Universe>	yeah... Chutt... how to dyou run it...
11:38	<Universe>	heh
11:38	<Chutt>	he said 'i assume from this that i'm supposed to run setup.pro'
11:39	<mdz_>	Chutt: the deb displays a note which includes a complete command line for running setup, suitable for cut-and-paste :-)
11:39	<Universe>	lol
11:39	<mdz_>	you want source, binary or diff?
11:40	<Chutt>	binary
11:40	<mdz_>	http://people.debian.org/~mdz/mythtv/
11:41	<mdz_>	WARNING: anyone else who happens to download that deb, you are doing so at your own risk
11:41	<mdz_>	to be honest, I have not even tested it on a machine with a capture card yet :-P
11:41	<Chutt>	heh
11:42	<rcaskey>	Chutt: I finally got Myth working with a video in card
11:42	<rcaskey>	great work
11:42	<rcaskey>	iv still got some v4l problem because all my video is miscolored
11:42	<mdz_>	mythepg runs though
11:43	<Chutt>	ok
11:43	<Chutt>	i need the xmltv debs
11:43	<Chutt>	and the lame deb
11:43	<mdz_>	oh, I thought I had sent you those urls already
11:43	<mdz_>	xmltv is at
11:43	<mdz_>	deb http://cedar-solutions.com:70/ftp/debian unstable main
11:43	<mdz_>	liblame is at
11:43	<mdz_>	deb http://marillat.free.fr unstable main
11:43	<Chutt>	ok
11:43	<Chutt>	lemme remove xmltv and lame and all that
11:44	<rcaskey>	Chutt: are you gonna submit these to unnstable?
11:44	<Chutt>	no
11:45	<rcaskey>	oh well, it will make life on my part much easier :)
11:47	<mdz_>	Chutt: you run your mysql database locally, right?
11:47	<mdz_>	mysql's privileges system is so fucked
11:48	<Chutt>	yup
11:49	<rcaskey>	oh good grief, no wonder my color was messed up
11:49	<mdz_>	I'll need to add a second grant to make that work
11:49	<rcaskey>	was using xawtv to adjust color and its widgets are just rejected
11:49	<mdz_>	it'll need to grant to user@localhost as well as user@'%'
11:49	<mdz_>	because obviously the wildcard doesn't match localhost
11:50	<Chutt>	know offhand how i delete an entire db?
11:50	<mdz_>	mysqladmin drop
11:51	<mdz_>	or mysqladmin -ublah -pblah drop
11:52	<rcaskey>	thx
11:52	<Chutt>	yeah
11:52	<Chutt>	'couldn't open db'
11:53	<mdz_>	download the latest deb from the same directory
11:53	-!-	rykr [~trillian@adsl-80-183-72.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #mythtv
11:53	<mdz_>	I added a second grant
11:54	<mdz_>	never mind, doesn't help
11:54	<mdz_>	this is the worst part of mysql
11:54	<Chutt>	the grant line in mc.sql works.
11:55	<mdz_>	that's basically what the new one does
11:55	<Chutt>	and i don't see a second grant line in the output of it
11:55	<mdz_>	hmm, you're right
11:56	<mdz_>	wait, did you download -2 or -3?
11:56	<Chutt>	2
11:56	<mdz_>	get -3
11:57	<mdz_>	mythtv-setup doesn't get very far without a capture card :-(
11:58	<mdz_>	dude you should fix mythtv so it works without a capture card that would r00lz
11:58	<Chutt>	heh
11:58	<Chutt>	rykr, nice email
11:59	<rykr>	Chutt - sure
11:59	<Chutt>	do you want me to paste the question from the FAQ about the audio?
12:00	<Chutt>	since you can't seem to read it
12:00	<mdz_>	whoa, you can actually control this tuner box with the serial port
12:00	<mdz_>	contrary to all of the documentation
12:01	<mdz_>	at least turn it on and off
12:01	<mdz_>	hmm, I would have fiddled with that before buying the IR blaster if I'd known
12:02	<mdz_>	might take a long time to brute-force all of the codes, though
12:02	<rykr>	Chutt - sure
12:02	<rcaskey>	what might cause myth to be channel off in its listings? like it shows that channel 43 is commedy central, but its really channel 44
12:02	<rykr>	Chutt- I was reading the FAQ on the website
12:03	<Chutt>	rcaskey, use canada-cable instead of us-cable
12:03	<vektor>	nobody in canada uses canada-cable as far as i can tell
12:03	<vektor>	i don't think it's valid
12:03	<Chutt>	vektor, tons of people do
12:03	<Chutt>	vektor, i get emails from people complaining about their channels being 1 off all the time
12:03	<vektor>	well, considering that i'm in canada and doug is in canada and it does not match our systems...
12:04	<vektor>	for cable?? really??
12:04	<Chutt>	yeah
12:04	<vektor>	wtf...
12:04	<vektor>	is it just the west coast maybe??
12:04	<Chutt>	some guy in the us has to use it, too
12:04	<vektor>	how do televisions know then?
12:04	<vektor>	i mean, i never tell my TV i'm in canada vs us
12:04	<Chutt>	i dunno =)
12:04	<vektor>	it makes no sense.
12:05	<Chutt>	rykr, so you see that question in the distribution FAQ now?
12:06	<rykr>	yes, just sent you an email. I assumed you would have the latest faq linked to the website
12:06	<Chutt>	i didn't make the FAQ on the website
12:06	<Chutt>	oh, also
12:06	<Chutt>	you need to add /usr/local/lib to /etc/ld.so.conf
12:07	<Chutt>	if you want libraries in there to be found
12:07	<Chutt>	most newbies don't do that
12:07	<vektor>	Chutt: I'm going to do a loader for the DScaler channels file.
12:07	<vektor>	Chutt: I think their frequency tables make more sense.
12:07	<Chutt>	that's been answered twice on the mailing list in the past week, as well
12:07	<rykr>	Chutt - thanks for the guidance
12:08	<Chutt>	also, there's absolutely no way that mysql.txt didn't get installed if the other settings files didn't get installed
12:08	<rykr>	settings.txt was in /usr/local/share/mythtv I think
12:08	<rykr>	mysql.txt was not
12:08	<Chutt>	mdz, it skipped the connecting channel source to channel input step
12:08	<Chutt>	was theme.txt?
12:09	<rykr>	mysql.txt was only found in my unzip folder from the distribution. I did a system wide locate for it when setup wouldn't run
12:09	<rykr>	yes
12:09	<Chutt>	theme.txt and mysql.txt get installed from the exact same line
12:09	<mdz_>	Chutt: what did? setup?
12:09	<Chutt>	mdz, yes
12:09	<mdz_>	Chutt: I didn't modify setup one whit
12:09	<Chutt>	mdz, the mythtv user probably doesn't have permissions on the video dev files
12:09	<rykr>	well I guess you shouldn't take the word of a newbie :-)
12:10	<mdz_>	fixing
12:10	<mdz_>	I thought I had added it to the video group
12:10	<Chutt>	well
12:10	<Chutt>	my video devs aren't owned by the video group
12:10	<mdz_>	they ought to be
12:10	<Chutt>	since debian doesn't create them, ever
12:11	<mdz_>	I use devfs
12:11	<mdz_>	and devfsd makes them group video
12:11	<Chutt>	i don't use devfs =)
12:12	<rykr>	do you know if anyone is using Hauppauge WinTV-D or the Creative Labs Digital VCR with MythTV?
12:12	<Chutt>	linux drivers for those cards don't exist
12:12	<Chutt>	so it'd be kind of difficult.
12:12	<rykr>	really?!?!?!!?
12:12	<mdz_>	I'll add a call to MAKEDEV then
12:12	<mdz_>	MAKEDEV also creates them with the correct permissions
12:13	<Chutt>	mdz, that'll work
12:14	<rcaskey>	Chutt, are you still using that TV Wonder VE?
12:14	<Chutt>	and a hauppauge wintv-radio
12:15	<rcaskey>	ahh, nm, I was gonna see what you had for your brightness settings and the like
12:15	<Chutt>	i use the hauppauge card as the main one, too
12:15	<Chutt>	cleaner picture, and it does stereo
12:16	<mdz_>	I dunno if MAKEDEV will fix the permissions on existing devices, though
12:16	<Chutt>	yeah
12:16	<Chutt>	i dunno what to do 'bout that
12:16	<mdz_>	I don't have any non-devfs systems to test on :-P
12:16	<mdz_>	anyway the latest package is uploaded now
12:16	<Chutt>	actually
12:17	<rcaskey>	Chutt: whats the apt source?
12:17	<Chutt>	don't use them yet
12:17	<Chutt>	as mdz said.
12:17	<Chutt>	mdz, still -3?
12:17	<mdz_>	there will not be an apt source until they are suitable for public consumption
12:17	<mdz_>	Chutt: yep
12:18	<mdz_>	and the xmltv stuff is in unstable
12:18	<Chutt>	it is?
12:18	<Chutt>	excellent
12:18	<mdz_>	no, there will not be an apt sourc efor mythtv until it is
12:18	<Chutt>	oh, heh
12:18	<mdz_>	but...it should be ready to upload
12:18	<rcaskey>	so is it currently b0rk?
12:18	<-- rykr	(~trillian@adsl-80-183-72.bna.bellsouth.net) has left #mythtv
12:19	<Chutt>	mdz, still didn't work
12:19	<Chutt>	that's weird
12:19	<mdz_>	which part?
12:19	<mdz_>	the setup thing?
12:19	<Chutt>	same part
12:19	<Chutt>	yeah
12:20	<Chutt>	something reset permissions on the /dev/video symlink
12:20	<mdz_>	nice, I guess makedev does it
12:21	<Chutt>	hrm
12:21	<Chutt>	still nothing
12:21	-!-	Antw73 [~ant@krynn.solace.mh.se] has joined #mythtv
12:21	<mdz_>	yep, it does an unconditional chown/chmod
12:21	<Chutt>	i need to go rake the yard, though
12:21	<Antw73>	evening all
12:21	<mdz_>	so, setup puts the card config in the database, then pulls it out to do the associations
12:21	<mdz_>	it looks like
12:21	<Chutt>	and it also probes the card
12:21	<mdz_>	hmm
12:21	<mdz_>	and doesn't report any errors :-)
12:22	<mdz_>	you can always run it as root, I suppose
12:22	<mdz_>	but I'd like to fix it
12:22	<mdz_>	I'll be putting it on my test box as soon as it is not in use
12:22	<Antw73>	Chutt: got more of a handle on the different file formats and codecs now, started coding a MythTV->VideoCD module a couple of hours ago
12:23	<mdz_>	Antw73: for playing VCDs or making them?
12:23	<Antw73>	Making them from MythTV files
12:23	<mdz_>	nice
12:24	<Antw73>	As per Chutts preference its an external module, I am using some of the classes from Myth however
12:24	<rcaskey>	oh thats sweet, will it be able to record directly or have to burn an already recorded program?
12:24	<mdz_>	I ran setup as the user that I run mythtv as
12:24	<mdz_>	and it certainly worked
12:24	<mdz_>	I wonder what the problem is
12:25	<Antw73>	Burn, pre-recorded shows only. Takes a while to convert from Myth format to VCD format too
12:25	<Antw73>	Anyone else been playing with the nvtv program?
12:27	<Antw73>	ok, anyone else using Tv out on an Nvidia card? =)
12:28	<Chutt>	ant, i need to sit down with nvtv some day and get it working on my card properly
12:28	<Chutt>	and, lemme know how that vcd converter comes out =)
12:28	<Antw73>	: I've got it working well, just wondering if anyone has done integration with MythTV so I don't have to do it manual =)
12:29	<Chutt>	ah
12:29	<Chutt>	not that i know of
12:29	<mdz_>	why would it need to be integrated with mythtv?
12:29	<mdz_>	wouldn't you just run it at boot or something?
12:29	<Antw73>	depends if MythTV is all the machine does, I'm using mine as a MAME console too, and that needs different settings in nvtv
12:30	<mdz_>	ah
12:30	<Antw73>	: its not a big prob, just running a script before starting the different things, but automatics are allways nice so I can avoid the keyboard completly
12:31	<Chutt>	have you tried xmame with the xv support patch?
12:31	<Antw73>	no way today of running a script before starting a myth app?
12:31	<Antw73>	yup, the XV scaling is ok, but doesn't seem to work so well on my low power system
12:32	<Antw73>	: running in DGA mode and setting the TV out via nvtv
12:33	<Antw73>	At some point I'm going to have to spring for a new CPU, but I'd rather wait until after xmas
12:36	<Chutt>	heh
12:36	<Antw73>	Other than minor stuff like that, my media machine is really starting to shape up =)
12:37	<Antw73>	Just VCD handling, and the big wooden box for the machine to finish things off and I'll be a happy puppy
12:37	<Chutt>	that rykr guy's email to me was funny
12:37	<Antw73>	On the mailing list?
12:37	<Chutt>	'I a interested in helping make MythTV a great product but if this is how you greet new folks, I'm not sure.'
12:37	<Chutt>	no, privately to me in response to his email on the mailing list =)
12:38	<Antw73>	heh
12:38	<Universe>	lol
12:38	<Universe>	sounds like a kind that can't spell
12:38	<Universe>	err kid
12:39	<Chutt>	ah well
12:39	<Chutt>	now i really need to go move leaves around with a rake
12:39	<Chutt>	no fun :(
12:39	<Antw73>	oh well, enjoy the outside anyways =)
12:40	<Universe>	heh
12:40	<Universe>	outside? isn't that dangerous?
12:40	<Universe>	have fun Chutt
12:40	<Antw73>	bleh =) fresh air never killed anyone
12:46	<rcaskey>	hey Chutt, does MythTV support IRC yet?
12:46	<vektor>	rcaskey: wrong way to ask
12:46	<Antw73>	IRC? why would a TV app support IRC? =)
12:46	<vektor>	rcaskey: everyone thinks you mean internet relay chat
12:47	<vektor>	rcaskey: you should ask "does MythTV support fine tuning of channels"
12:47	<rcaskey>	(err fine tuning of chanels)
12:47	<Antw73>	Ahhhh, then yes it does I thought, same way xawtv does
12:47	<Antw73>	you might need to set it manually in the database but I think MythTV reads the data from there
12:47	<-- Universe	has quit ()
12:48	<Antw73>	Let me look in the code, one sec to verify
12:54	<rcaskey>	because im on IRC cable im getting the wrong channel listings and colors
12:56	<Antw73>	Yes it supports finetuning if the finetune value is set in the DB
12:56	<rcaskey>	ahh oky
12:57	<Antw73>	So you should be able to check the finetune value in xawtv and use that value in the mythconverg.channels table
12:58	<Antw73>	can't offhand see any UI way of setting the finetune in MythTV, but i may be blind, check with Chutt when he gets back from the garden on that, but directly hacking the DB should do it =)
12:58	<rcaskey>	hmm, it has to be an int value
12:58	<Antw73>	yes, but the finetune in xawtv is also just an int, those fines are VERY fine I think
12:59	<Antw73>	say in thousands of the frquency setting or somewhere abouts that
13:00	<rcaskey>	Antw73: so its absolute and not relative?
13:00	<Antw73>	no, its relative to the current channel, either pos or neg
13:01	<Antw73>	vektor: thanks for the translation btw
13:01	<rcaskey>	ok
13:01	<rcaskey>	so 1250 is probably what I need then
13:02	<Antw73>	that much? ouch
13:03	<Antw73>	isn't that enough to push up a channel or two?
13:03	<rcaskey>	Antw73: err whats 1.25 mhz up?
13:04	<Antw73>	Not sure that you can directly translate the finetune like that, you might need to play about a bit in xawtv to test if it doesn't work for you
13:04	<rcaskey>	what are the fine tune buttons in xawtv? iv got the mhz rating from tvtime
13:04	<Antw73>	you might be better off finding the correct frequncy table and mailing it to the mythtv list and getting it added
13:05	<rcaskey>	a quick google didn't turn it up
13:05	<Antw73>	in xawtv I think finetune is left and right arrows
13:05	<Antw73>	not sure you'll get that to tune so much up or down tho
13:06	<rcaskey>	diz: they say i should be able to set it in the database
13:06	<vektor>	diz isn't on this channel
13:06	<rcaskey>	doh
13:06	<vektor>	and he just discovered that the finetune doesn't seem to be used in mythtv
13:06	<rcaskey>	;P
13:06	<vektor>	but you can recompile to set it
13:07	<vektor>	at least that's his hypothesis
13:08	<Antw73>	vektor: looks used to me, if its set in the DB. Is he using 0.6 or CVS?
13:09	<rcaskey>	ahh, is CVS in a runnable state?
13:09	<vektor>	i have no idea and i have no business repeating rumors from irc :)
13:09	<Antw73>	vektor: heh
13:09	<Antw73>	rcaskey: was a few days ago when I took out a copy anyways
13:10	<rcaskey>	n
13:11	<rcaskey>	doh, stupid cat
13:12	<Antw73>	rcaskey: actually I think Chutt is generally pretty good about not commiting broken code to CVS, at least not for too long
13:14	<mdz_>	use of mythtv CVS is encouraged only if you are willing to debug problems rather than just complaining about them
13:15	<mdz_>	s/willing to/& (and capable of)/
13:15	<Antw73>	mdz_: true true
13:16	<Antw73>	but personally I'd rather people bang on new code than start uncomenting and hacking older versions to enable newer (possibly incomplete) functions....
13:22	<Antw73>	grrrr, program table isn't updating again. Before I start rooting about looking for the cause, anyone heard of this before?
13:31	-!-	rykr [~trillian@adsl-80-183-72.bna.bellsouth.net] has joined #mythtv
13:33	<Chutt>	rcaskey, current CVS will become 0.7 tonight, so it's stable :p
13:34	<Chutt>	and 0.6 has the finetuning stuff in it, it just needs to be set in the database
13:35	<Antw73>	Chutt: thanks for the clear up =) leaves not bugged you too much we hope =)
13:35	<Chutt>	naw
13:36	<Chutt>	just 7 30 gallon bags full
13:36	<Antw73>	Chutt: the question about VCR and badly syncing audio sounds suspiciously like the problem we were banging on a few weeks ago
13:36	<Chutt>	it very well could be
13:36	<Antw73>	how many bags =) ick
13:36	<Chutt>	i'll ask him to upgrade once i put out 0.7
13:37	<Antw73>	k, I won't answer it then
13:38	<Antw73>	before I get complicated, the program tables are supposed to update themselves or do I have to set that up somewhere?
13:39	<Chutt>	which program tables?
13:39	<Chutt>	you mean the filldatabase stuff?
13:39	<Antw73>	well, yes, but after initial filling
13:39	<Chutt>	the best thing to do with that is put it in a crontab somewhere
13:40	<Chutt>	however often you want to update things =)
13:40	<Antw73>	ok, so its not in mythfrontend then
13:40	<Chutt>	right
13:40	<-- rykr	(~trillian@adsl-80-183-72.bna.bellsouth.net) has left #mythtv
13:40	<Antw73>	right then, wondered why I couldn't find it =)
13:40	<Chutt>	i keep meaning to have the scheduler fork off a process to do that
13:40	<Chutt>	but the frequency of the updates is going to vary based on which grabber you're using
13:40	<Chutt>	how many days each gets, etc
13:40	<Antw73>	I may have to send you a minor patch for running updates on tv_grab_sn then
13:41	<Chutt>	heh
13:41	<Chutt>	sure
13:41	<rcaskey>	hey chutt, frequency fine tuning works in cvs but not in .6 right?
13:41	<Chutt>	rcaskey, i'm pretty sure it works in 0.6
13:41	<Chutt>	could be wrong, though =)
13:41	<rcaskey>	oky, well I just upgraded to cvs so we will see shortly :)
13:42	<rcaskey>	and for a 1.25 mhz adjust I need to put in a value of 1250?
13:42	<Antw73>	Chutt: when are you planning on going out with 0.7? Do I have time to fix the tv_grab_sn before?
13:42	<Chutt>	antw73, ah, sometime this evening. it's around 2 pm here now
13:43	<mdz_>	Chutt: so about this setup problem...
13:44	<Chutt>	mdz, aye?
13:44	<mdz_>	Chutt: I'm drawing a blank. any guesses where it's going wrong?
13:44	<mdz_>	Chutt: it is successfully probing the card, yes? it looks like it would spit out an error if not
13:45	<mdz_>	and then it calls selectsource for each input
13:45	<Chutt>	hmm
13:45	<mdz_>	perhaps it isn't finding the cards in the db?
13:45	<Chutt>	the only way i see that it wouldn't spit out an error message
13:45	<Chutt>	is if the cards weren't in the database
13:45	<mdz_>	right
13:45	<mdz_>	are they?
13:45	<Chutt>	where exactly do you create the database tables? =)
13:45	<mdz_>	aha
13:46	<Chutt>	since, well, none of them are in there
13:46	<mdz_>	setup doesn't?
13:46	<Chutt>	no
13:46	<Chutt>	the mysql < mc.sql does
13:46	<mdz_>	ok, that's easy enough then
13:46	<Chutt>	or whatever
13:46	<mdz_>	but setup seems like a logical place to do that
13:46	<Chutt>	probably
13:46	<Chutt>	but i'll leave that for when i'm not changing stuff around all the time
13:47	<Chutt>	i'd rather not have big multi-version database upgrade junk in there
13:50	<rcaskey>	hey Chutt, how many ticks in Myth are equivalent to a channel?
13:50	<Chutt>	it's the exact same as in xawtv
13:51	<Chutt>	the frequency setting code and finetuning amounts and tables are all identical
13:51	<rcaskey>	Chutt: I gotta figure out how to do fine tuning in xawtv, i got the mhz listing in myth right
13:51	<rcaskey>	I can bump it up 6 and i get the right picture but im an entire channel off
13:51	<Chutt>	are you absolutely sure you're using the right frequency table?
13:52	<rcaskey>	vektor: do you know a site or doc that has info about how to fine tune with xawtv, i cant find it on the net
13:53	<rcaskey>	Chutt: certain
13:53	<rcaskey>	im on standard NTSC but its IRC
13:53	<vektor>	Chutt: i've seen other people with this before, and diz (who wrote frequencies.*) explained it to me.
13:54	<vektor>	Chutt: diz wasn't 'finished' frequencies.[h,c] when they were used by everyone.
13:54	<vektor>	Chutt: There's a type of cable called IRC for incrementally related carrier.
13:54	<vektor>	Chutt: Anyway to support it you have to add 1.25MHz to all the channel numbers.
13:55	<vektor>	rcaskey: There's a fine tune option in the .xawtvrc file. See man xawtvrc I think.
13:55	<vektor>	Chutt: Also, there's a better version of frequencies.c in diz's app 'tvset'. You should take a look at it. Also, he'd appreciate an email to know that you're using his code.
13:55	<vektor>	Chutt: tvset is at http://linuxtv.openprojects.net/
13:56	<vektor>	Chutt: diz hangs out on #livid on this network.
13:56	<rcaskey>	vektor: 6 ticks makes it look alright but its entire channel # off
13:56	<rcaskey>	so im not really sure even what to put in xawrc
13:57	<rcaskey>	is there anywhere that says what the tick means in terms of mhz?
13:57	<vektor>	Well I don't know either, I didn't write xawtv
13:57	<vektor>	No I have no idea.
13:59	<Chutt>	the ntsc_cable table in there looks identical to every IRC list that i see online
14:02	<vektor>	well, maybe his theory is wrong then.
14:02	<vektor>	i have no clue.
14:02	-!-	diz [~diz@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk] has joined #mythtv
14:03	<vektor>	diz, meet chutt. chutt, meet diz.
14:03	<Chutt>	hi
14:03	<diz>	chutt: the original channels.h file is at http://linuxtv.openprojects.net in tvset
14:04	<diz>	you might like it a lot better than the way it's been contorted by gerd
14:05	<diz>	at any rate there are 4 standard variations on NTSC cable tv frequencies
14:05	<diz>	these are mostly fixed offsets, like 1.25MHz for NTSC IRC CATV
14:06	<Antw73>	diz: yer untarred link is broken
14:06	<diz>	HRC and IRC are the most common
14:06	<diz>	yes it is broken.
14:06	<diz>	it's been broken since 1998
14:06	<Antw73>	heh, nm then
14:07	<Chutt>	heh, actually, i like gerd's format better
14:07	<Chutt>	it's a lot more readable
14:07	<diz>	if you say so.
14:08	<diz>	but then agian you like C++ and i despise it
14:09	<Chutt>	err, whatever
14:09	<diz>	vektor: i forgot with HRC and IRC, there are special cases for channels 5 and 6
14:10	<vektor>	diz: ok
14:10	<mdz_>	god I hate the shell
14:20	<Chutt>	rcaskey, anyway, by what offset you said worked, i'm 100% sure things will work if you set canada-cable as the FreqTab setting in settings.txt
14:20	<Chutt>	and don't use any finetuning offset
14:20	<Chutt>	since the channel numbers are off by one and just about exactly that finetuning amount
14:21	<diz>	chutt: you're blindly using my tuning code...
14:21	<Chutt>	of course i am
14:21	<diz>	the channels are off by 5 which is NOT 5MHz
14:21	<Chutt>	err
14:21	<diz>	it's 1.25MHz
14:21	<Chutt>	he said a modification of 6/16ths of a Mhz made things look right
14:21	<Antw73>	Chutt: have a couple of small filldata.cpp patches to send to you once I get home, you can choose to apply em or not, but they make things easier for us poor swedes =)
14:22	<Chutt>	but then the channel numbers were 1 off of what they should be
14:22	<diz>	chutt: he tells me that 1.25MHz is the proper correction (it looked good)
14:22	<Chutt>	he told _me_ that a finetuning of '6' looked right.
14:23	<Chutt>	[13:57][13:57] <rcaskey> vektor: 6 ticks makes it look alright but its entire channel # off
14:23	<diz>	interesting.
14:23	<Chutt>	which is 6/16ths of a Mhz
14:24	<rcaskey>	mmm through a process of trial and error I found the magic # is 106 :)
14:24	<diz>	so in #livid we determined that he did a finetune by 7.25MHz
14:24	<diz>	and that's why he was off a channel
14:25	<Chutt>	rcaskey, congrats, you just proved me right :p
14:25	<Chutt>	rcaskey, that's the difference between us-cable and canada-cable :p
14:26	<mdz_>	Chutt: new deb uploading now
14:26	<diz>	there's no such thing as "canada cable"
14:26	<rcaskey>	ok, glad to be of service for once ;P
14:26	<mdz_>	Chutt: should do the schema automagically
14:26	<vektor>	diz: thank you! :)
14:26	<Chutt>	diz, i honestly don't care if there's no such thing as it
14:26	<Chutt>	it works
14:26	<vektor>	there is clearly some form of tuner where things are off-by-one though.
14:26	<diz>	well calling something "canada cable" is just wrong
14:26	<rcaskey>	vektor: cable here is wier
14:26	<rcaskey>	err wierd
14:26	<Chutt>	so talk to gerd
14:27	<Chutt>	since he named it that
14:27	<diz>	i think the problem is that there's a standard where it's -1.25MHz
14:27	<rcaskey>	our apartment complex gets a satelite feed and redistributes it
14:27	<rcaskey>	quality is aweful and the bundle it into the rent
14:27	<diz>	rather than +1.25MHz
14:27	<rcaskey>	but we get decent premium channels
14:27	<diz>	plus there's a standard where it's -0.75MHz
14:27	<diz>	and another where it's +0.75MHz
14:27	<Chutt>	rcaskey, some guy at a college in the us had the same problem
14:28	<Chutt>	mdz, lemme know when its up
14:28	<rcaskey>	might wanna make sure not to overwrite any changes to the default channel value in the schema
14:28	<mdz_>	Chutt: done
14:28	<diz>	chutt: i can pretty much tell you exactly whcih cable tv companies in the us use which frequencies if you really care
14:28	<mdz_>	Chutt: I hacked up mc.sql so it didn't hardcode the database name
14:28	<diz>	but you apparently don't
14:28	<rcaskey>	err finetune value
14:28	<mdz_>	Chutt: and used CREATE TABLE IF NOT EXISTS
14:28	<-- diz	(~diz@parcelfarce.linux.theplanet.co.uk) has left #mythtv
14:28	<Chutt>	mdz, url again?
14:28	<Chutt>	aww, he left
14:29	<Chutt>	thanks
14:29	<vektor>	Chutt: sorry
14:30	* mdz_	reads argument-scrollback
14:30	<Chutt>	heh
14:30	<Chutt>	not much of an argument
14:30	<Chutt>	'that frequency table doesn't exist!'
14:30	<mdz_>	it sounds like in the end the only issue is the name of the frequency table
14:31	<Chutt>	'it's in the code named like that'
14:31	<Chutt>	basically
14:31	<Antw73>	I think he sounded hostile from the start, oh well
14:31	<Chutt>	i can rename it 'us-cable-one-channel-off' =)
14:31	<Chutt>	well, one and change
14:32	<vektor>	he's quite pissed off i think that everyone used his frequencies code without telling him
14:32	<mdz_>	"canada" is a pretty good name for "off by one-and-change"
14:32	* mdz_	fucks
14:32	<vektor>	and used a bad old version and that
14:32	* mdz_	er, ducks
14:32	<vektor>	mdz: loser :)
14:32	<vektor>	and then adding stuff like 'canada-cable' when that's not what it is :)
14:32	<Chutt>	vektor, i just grabbed it from xawtv
14:32	<vektor>	Chutt: exactly.
14:32	<vektor>	Chutt: nathan didn't even know xawtv was using it.
14:32	<mdz_>	my word, the packaging for gstreamer is awful
14:32	<Antw73>	did he put it under GPL?
14:32	<vektor>	Antw73: no.
14:33	<mdz_>	all the stuff that ftpmaster rejects, and that gets in?
14:33	<Antw73>	what license?
14:33	<vektor>	Antw73: it was released without mentioning.
14:33	<Chutt>	it's under the GPL in that tvset distribution
14:33	<vektor>	Chutt: and that version predates tvset. i don't think tvset is explicitly gpl, is it?
14:33	<Antw73>	Chutt: yup, just saw that myself
14:34	<vektor>	but anyway
14:34	<vektor>	whatever.
14:34	<vektor>	i don't _really_ know anyway.
14:34	<vektor>	just my impression.
14:34	<Chutt>	heh
14:34	<Chutt>	mdz, works =)
14:35	* vektor	back later
14:35	<Antw73>	grrr, waiting for damn patch cluster to finish so I can go home and mail patches =)
14:35	<Chutt>	mdz, except that mythfilldatabase doesn't work as anything but the user that ran setup
14:36	<Chutt>	since it looks for the xmltv config file in the user's home dir
14:38	<Antw73>	cd ../S8MU7
14:38	<Antw73>	oops, wrong window, sorry
14:38	<Chutt>	mdz, but mythtv works
14:38	<mdz_>	Chutt: good
14:38	<Chutt>	and the frontend
14:39	<mdz_>	Chutt: that is annoying about xmltv, but the cron job will run it as the mythtv user anyway
14:39	<mdz_>	/etc/cron.daily/mythtv
14:39	<Chutt>	might want to add a note to edit the settings.txt
14:39	<Chutt>	yeah
14:39	<Chutt>	but for the initial database population
14:39	<mdz_>	right, setup runs mythfilldatabase, right?
14:39	<Chutt>	nope
14:39	-!-	Keyser[zzz] is now known as KeyserSoze
14:39	<mdz_>	but the debconf note says to run setup as mythtv :-)
14:39	<Chutt>	it says 'run mythfilldatabase'
14:39	<mdz_>	aha
14:39	<mdz_>	hmm
14:39	<Chutt>	or 'run mythfilldatabase --manual'
14:39	<Chutt>	if you're using the xmltv grabber
14:40	<Chutt>	err
14:40	<Chutt>	eurpoean xmltv grabbers
14:40	<Antw73>	mutter =)
14:40	<Chutt>	and, just a note to edit the settings files to set the grabber and path names would work
14:40	<Chutt>	it'd be better than most .debs, at least
14:40	<Chutt>	'here, i'm going to install this for you, but you're screwed when you want to figure out what to run!'
14:41	<Antw73>	heh
14:41	<mdz_>	oh, I forgot about the grabber
14:41	<mdz_>	I could easily add a question for that
14:41	<Chutt>	well
14:41	<Chutt>	there's that
14:41	<Chutt>	and path names and buffer sizes
14:41	<Chutt>	and junk like that
14:41	<Antw73>	mdz: you might be better leaving the grabber out or making a separate .deb for each grabber
14:42	<mdz_>	the grabber doesn't need to be set before setup runs, does it?
14:42	<Chutt>	yes
14:42	<Chutt>	it does
14:42	<mdz_>	Antw73: the grabber is in the xmltv package, of course
14:42	<Chutt>	setup runs <grabber> --configure
14:42	<mdz_>	gah
14:42	<Antw73>	yes, but the different grabbers for different zones require some different Perl modules
14:43	<Chutt>	the xmltv debs just install all that junk
14:43	<Antw73>	great, ignore me then =)
14:43	<Chutt>	heh
14:43	<mdz_>	I'll add a question for the grabber, since that's necessary to complete the setup
14:43	<mdz_>	and then a note to tweak settings.txt
14:43	<Chutt>	selectable list
14:43	<Chutt>	?
14:43	<mdz_>	yeah
14:43	<Chutt>	cool
14:44	<mdz_>	I guess I'll have to hardcode it
14:44	<mdz_>	unless xmltv provides that information in a useful way
14:44	<Chutt>	it doesn't
14:44	<mdz_>	you think medium or high priority for the grabber question?
14:44	<mdz_>	what's the US/non-US breakdown for your users?
14:45	<mdz_>	er, north america/non-north-america
14:45	<mdz_>	tv_grab_na/tv_grab_non-na
14:45	<Antw73>	heh
14:45	<Chutt>	mostly us
14:46	<Chutt>	good deal of non-us people, though
14:46	<Antw73>	I have a feeling the euro count will be higher when we can get the non-us stuff working a bit more automatically
14:47	<Chutt>	probably
14:47	<Antw73>	a lot of that is dependant on some xmltv peculiarities though
14:47	<mdz_>	I could generate a default based on the user's locale settings
14:47	<mdz_>	but that sounds like too much work :-)
14:47	<Antw73>	great, my patching is done, I am gonna go home and test the patches I have done to filldata.cpp and then mail em off
14:47	<Antw73>	mdz: NOOOO =)
14:47	<Chutt>	cool.
14:48	<Antw73>	most euro's using linux set their locale to en_US.iso8859-1
14:48	<Antw73>	and only the timezone to europe
14:49	<Antw73>	setting locale to anything else makes a lot of applications a real pain
14:50	<Antw73>	right, I am off for a bit back when I get home through the 4 inches of snow that fell since i have been at work =(
14:51	<Chutt>	heh
14:51	<Chutt>	that's really no fun
14:52	<Antw73>	well, It'll be fun tommorrow afternoon since they open the skislope in town then =) snowboard time
14:52	<Antw73>	byebye
14:52	-!-	Antw73 [] has quit ["BitchX: nine out of ten doctors recommend it"]
14:53	<Chutt>	heh
15:02	<mdz_>	new package with the grabber configuration uploading now
15:02	<Chutt>	ok, cool
15:03	<mdz_>	so how to handle getting mythfilldatabase run by the right user at configuration time...hmm
15:03	<mdz_>	maybe postinst should just run setup
15:03	<mdz_>	I'd rather it didn't get all interactive though
15:03	<Chutt>	yeah
15:03	<Chutt>	to the 'not getting all interactive'
15:03	<Chutt>	let the user run it
15:04	<Chutt>	just patch setup to say the same line as the dialog prompt did
15:04	<mdz_>	hmm, the freqtable needs a question too I should thin
15:04	<mdz_>	k
15:04	<Chutt>	to give them a line to cut and paste to run mythfilldatabase as the proper user
15:04	<Chutt>	mdz, really lots of stuff in settings.txt needs a question
15:04	<Chutt>	the file locations, the freqtab, the tv norm, all that
15:05	<mdz_>	well, all I'm interested in is making it so that after the questions are answered and the instructions followed for running setup, they can actually start mythtv and have it work
15:05	<mdz_>	the file locations are set to sane defaults
15:05	<Chutt>	are they?
15:05	<mdz_>	well, directories that exist and have proper permissions
15:05	<Chutt>	ah, true
15:05	<mdz_>	whether the user has enough disk is their problem :-P
15:05	<Chutt>	heh
15:05	<mdz_>	that ~/.xmltv stuff is going to be a huge pain
15:05	<Chutt>	ask for the TVFormat and FreqTable settings
15:06	<Chutt>	well
15:06	<Chutt>	you _could_ make it get stored in /etc/
15:06	<mdz_>	imagine the user who wants to mount their big disk over /var/lib/mythtv
15:06	<mdz_>	they look, and there are no files in it
15:06	<mdz_>	so they mount, and suddenly mythfilldatabase doesn't work anymore
15:06	<mdz_>	I would be happy if it just didn't start with a damn dot :-)
15:07	<mdz_>	should there be any other options for TVFormat other than NTSC and PAL?
15:07	<Chutt>	yeah
15:07	<vektor>	mdz: lots.
15:07	<Chutt>	NTSC, PAL, SECAM, PAL-NC, PAL-M, PAL-N, NTSC-JP
15:08	<vektor>	NTSC-JP, SECAM, PAL-NC, PAL-M, PAL-N at least
15:08	<Chutt>	is what i have in the list
15:08	<vektor>	hehe
15:08	<vektor>	Chutt: There are more.
15:08	<Chutt>	right
15:08	<vektor>	But the bttv driver only supports those.
15:09	<Chutt>	mdz, the freqtab list is at the bottom of libs/libmythtv/frequencies.c
15:09	<mdz_>	Chutt: already there :-)
15:09	<Chutt>	the strings on the left column
15:09	<Chutt>	ah, good
15:09	<Chutt>	default it to us-cable, and that'll grab most people
15:09	<mdz_>	not very cut-and-pasteable, though :-P
15:09	<Chutt>	bah
15:13	<mdz_>	are the config file variable names case-sensitive?
15:14	<Chutt>	yes
15:14	<Chutt>	i've been meaning to redo the config file stuff
15:14	<Chutt>	but i'm lazy
15:14	<mdz_>	what would be good defaults? NTSC/us-cable?
15:15	<mdz_>	or will the euros protest? :-)
15:15	<Chutt>	i'd prefer those defaults
15:15	<mdz_>	ok, I'll default to those and tv_grab_na
15:15	<Chutt>	so do i get debs for mythmusic too sometime? =)
15:16	<mdz_>	new package uploading
15:16	<mdz_>	yeah, I've not had mythmusic since I switched to using the debs :-)
15:16	<mdz_>	I'm not a huge mythmusic user, though
15:16	<Chutt>	ah
15:16	<mdz_>	it should be a bunch easier than mythtv though
15:16	<Chutt>	well, it should be very easy
15:16	<mdz_>	it's been a while...does anything need to be configured other than the directory holding the music?
15:16	<Chutt>	everything it depends on is already in debian
15:17	<Chutt>	nope, not really
15:17	<Chutt>	the display order of all the song data can be configured, but the defaults are pretty sane
15:17	<mdz_>	ok, new deb is up
15:19	<mdz_>	so at debconf priority newbie^Whigh, it will only ask 3 questions and tell them how to run setup
15:20	-!-	rcaskey [] has quit ["My damn controlling terminal disappeared!"]
15:20	<mdz_>	I guess I should update it to current CVS now
15:20	<Chutt>	tvformat didn't get set
15:21	<Chutt>	str TVFormat=
15:21	<mdz_>	crap
15:21	<mdz_>	ok, fixed
15:22	<mdz_>	also adjusted the instructions in setup for running mythfilldatabase
15:22	<mdz_>	and updated to current CVS
15:22	<mdz_>	rebuilding now
15:22	-!-	KeyserSoze [] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)]
15:23	<Namapoos>	how much does the EPG download?
15:24	<Namapoos>	does it download per request, or a week at a time?
15:24	<mdz_>	Namapoos: depends on how many channels you have
15:24	<mdz_>	Namapoos: it looks like it does one HTTP request per channel per day
15:24	<Chutt>	the data is served up one webpage per channel per day
15:25	<mdz_>	for my digital cable channels (minus pay per view and stuff I don't get) is about 1 megabyte per day
15:25	<Namapoos>	so you can't look ahead a few days?
15:25	<Chutt>	err
15:26	<mdz_>	Chutt: new deb is up
15:26	<Chutt>	you still haven't run things yet, have you? :p
15:26	<mdz_>	Namapoos: it downloads the data ahead of time into a database
15:27	<Chutt>	generally, 8 days worth of data
15:27	<Namapoos>	i understand that, but how many days?
15:27	<Namapoos>	ahhh
15:27	<Namapoos>	ok
15:27	<Namapoos>	so essentially a week at a time
15:27	<Chutt>	but that can all be modified, etc
15:27	<Chutt>	some of the grabbers only support a week in advance
15:29	<Chutt>	is 'crontab -u mythtv -l' supposed to show something? =)
15:30	<mdz_>	nope
15:30	<mdz_>	cat /etc/cron.daily/mythtv
15:30	<Chutt>	ah
15:30	<Chutt>	excellet
15:30	<mdz_>	maybe I should switch it to cron.d
15:30	<Chutt>	excellent, too