TheGrebs.com:IRC Logs:#linode:2005:01:22

---	Log	opened Sat Jan 22 00:00:25 2005
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00:08	@caker	fo0bar: meaning the reverses don't forward?
00:10	fo0bar	yeah
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00:13	SupaDongzu	jasonf: people demand things because they lack the servants necessary to do it for them
00:13	mikegrb	SupaDongzu: :D
00:25	mikegrb	caker: http://engadget.com/entry/1234000860028381/ <-- your christmas present this year
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02:04	tmc	hello
02:04	tmc	anyone awake ?
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03:01	@linbot	New news from forums: Performance vs Virtuozzo in Sales Questions and Answers
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04:38	@linbot	New news from forums: Hunting: Brilliant Firewall builder for debian in Linux Networking
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04:58	adamg	morning all
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10:28	adamg	hmm
10:30	@linbot	New news from forums: Screen freezing during woody->sarge upgrades in Feature Request/Bug Report
10:37	@caker	linbot: weather 19019
10:37	@linbot	caker: The current temperature in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania is 14�F (10:34 AM EST on January 22, 2005). Conditions: Light Snow Showers. Humidity: 73%. Dew Point: 7�F. Wind: ENE at 8 mph (13 km/h). Pressure: 30.14 in (1020 hPa). Visibility: 1.8 miles (2.8 kilometers). UV: 1 out of 12
10:37	@caker	ugh
10:39	adamg	aint you home for the weekend?
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10:39	@caker	leaving in a few hours, but eastern US is under a blizzard
10:39	@caker	estimated 7-14" of snow by the time I get there
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10:40	adamg	just hope the airport is still going to be open
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10:42		* adamg brain has stopped working
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10:45	mikegrb	linbot: weather kpns
10:45	@linbot	mikegrb: The current temperature in Pensacola Regional, Florida is 63�F (8:53 AM CST on January 22, 2005). Conditions: Overcast. Humidity: 94%. Dew Point: 61�F. Pressure: 30.03 in (1017 hPa). Visibility: 10.0 miles (16.1 kilometers). UV: 1 out of 12
10:45	mikegrb	63!
10:45	mikegrb	:D
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11:04	adamg	hmm
11:05	adamg	hmm it never snows over here
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11:27	@caker	mmm, they just added two hour delay to my flight
11:27	mikegrb	mmmmmmmmm flight delays, tasty
11:28	@caker	make that five hours delay, now
11:28		* caker stabs
11:28	@caker	Scheduled Time:
11:28	@caker	11:25am
11:29	mikegrb	that's less tasty
11:29	@caker	guess I'll work on host41 and 42 now ...
11:30	gxt	I'm thinking about getting a Linode account, but I'm not sure how I would go about backing up my disk images. Anyone care to elucidate?
11:30	mikegrb	gxt: there are many many ways you could do it
11:31	mikegrb	I personally use rsync to another box
11:33	gxt	Thanks mikegrb. I was also wondering where inbound traffic fits into the transfer limit. If I update a gentoo distribution with 100mb of packages, does that lower my allotment for the month?
11:33	adamg	yes
11:33	adamg	all traffic is counted inbound and outbound
11:33	gxt	Thanks adamg.
11:34	adamg	caker at least you found out there was a delay before you had checked in
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11:50		* adamg wonders if he will sign up
11:50	@linbot	New news from forums: Kernel: 2.6.10-linode11 (Latest 2.6) in Linode.com Announcements
11:55	@caker	http://www.theshore.net/~caker/cfq-ts-rejects.txt <-- grrr
11:55		* mikegrb rejects caker
11:55		* caker patchbombs mikegrb
11:56	mikegrb	:O
11:56	mikegrb	DiscoveryHD concidered good
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12:24	mikegrb	caker: http://www.olafdietsche.de/linux/accessfs/ <- pretty interesting stuff
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12:56	Guest43	mikegrb would be nice if that made it into main steam and a bit more secure
12:56	---	User: *** Guest43 is now known as adamg
12:56	mikegrb	ja
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12:57	adamg	removes thw whole risk of having to run stuff initally as root
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13:04	mikegrb	I fixed my mod_rewrite regexps for thegrebs.com/irc finally
13:04	mikegrb	just need to update it to recognize the new logfile format
13:04	mikegrb	it currently understands like 3 different formats
13:12	adamg	cool
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13:16	adamg	i guess I should go back to coding
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13:17	adamg	lo
13:17	tmc	hello
13:18	tmc	im having a little trouble disabling exim in debian 3.0r1
13:18	tmc	has anyone here done this before?
13:18	adamg	how do you mean disable it
13:19	tmc	well
13:19	tmc	im actually trying to do this howto
13:20	tmc	http://www.qmailrocks.org/remove_db.htm
13:20	tmc	basicly stop the service, rename a couple things
13:20	tmc	i did everything on there except the postfix or w/e, and i rebooted, and exim is still running on port 25
13:20	tmc	so now
13:21	tmc	im trying to do that howto page over, and the /etc/init.d/exim is acting funny
13:21	tmc	it doesnt give me the syntax when i run it with nothing
13:21	tmc	3nter:/etc/init.d# ./bind
13:21	tmc	Usage: /etc/init.d/bind {start\|stop\|reload\|restart\|force-reload}
13:21	tmc	3nter:/etc/init.d# ./exim
13:21	tmc	3nter:/etc/init.d#
13:21	tmc	see what i amena
13:21	tmc	err mean
13:22	tmc	any ideas?
13:22	tmc	please?
13:23	adamg	update-rc.d exim remove
13:23	adamg	will stop it running at boot
13:30	tmc	update-rc.d: /etc/init.d/exim exists during rc.d purge (use -f to force)
13:30	tmc	d0 i for cei
13:30	tmc	err force
13:31	tmc	n/m thanks d00d
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13:38	tmc	erm
13:38	tmc	i just rebooted
13:38	tmc	and exim is still running =[
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14:03	tmc	inetd.conf:smtp stream tcp nowait mail /usr/sbin/exim exim -bs
14:03	tmc	does that load exim on boot?
14:03	@caker	ok then .. flight cancelled :/
14:07	tmc	caker are u getting my msgs?
14:07	@caker	tmc: yes
14:07	tmc	ok
14:07	@caker	tmc: sorry, I can't help you
14:08	@caker	tmc: what are you trying to do?
14:08	tmc	disable exim
14:08	tmc	so i can use qmail
14:08	@caker	tmc: http://www.google.com/search?q=debian+disable+exim
14:08	@caker	first libnk
14:08	@caker	*link
14:08	@caker	cd /etc/rc2.d
14:08	@caker	mv S20exim K20exim
14:09	tmc	i already removed exim from rc
14:09	tmc	im not very firmilure with all this.... does inetd.conf load on boot?
14:09	tmc	im assuming it does, but i dont know
14:10	adamg	caker are you going to be able to get another flight?
14:10	adamg	you could just do apt-get remove exim
14:10	adamg	but it will probably moan at you
14:10	@caker	adamg: checking now. If I can get in tomorrow, night, my parents have a hotel (Dad goes into surgery Monday morning)
14:11	adamg	where are you flying to?
14:11	@caker	Philly
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14:11	adamg	i thought your parents were in nj
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14:12	@caker	Yeah, but I fly into Philly when I travel there -- Where they live is only about an hour and 10 minutes away, and it's closer than flying into Newark, NJ
14:12	@caker	Plus, the surgery is in Philly, so I could just get there tomorrow night, without needing a ride to the airport to home
14:13	@caker	*ride from the airport to home, rather
14:14	@caker	http://www.intellicast.com/Local/USLocalWide.asp?loc=kphl&seg=LocalWeather&prodgrp=RadarImagery&product=RadarLoop&prodnav=none
14:14	@caker	PHL is Philadelphia
14:14	@caker	ACY is near the parents
14:16	adamg	cant see either on there
14:16	adamg	found them
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14:22	adamg	god I hate writing billing systens
14:25		* caker goes back to porting cfq-ts to 2.6.10
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14:43		* caker rescheduled his flight for Monday morning
14:44	adamg	ouch
14:52	adamg	will you be able to get in, in time?
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14:53	@caker	yeah. I'll arrive around noon, and he'll still be in surgery for quite a while, so.. That's better than bugging them tomorrow night. Sounds like he doesn't want to be around anyone before the surgery anyway...
14:54	adamg	at least you will be there when he gets out
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15:05	dataw0lf	Hello.
15:05	dataw0lf	caker around?
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15:06	@caker	yup
15:08	dataw0lf	Hey, couple my friends told me you were pondering putting Ubuntu on Linode, and I'm pretty active in the Ubuntu community, thought I'd come in here and throw my $.02 in.
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15:08	@caker	dataw0lf: yeah, I'm going to provide one fairly soon. I might be getting to it this weekend, actually
15:09	dataw0lf	caker: awesome, did you have any particular questions about the distro ?
15:10	@caker	dataw0lf: not really. Obviously this will be a non-X install. I imagine that won't be that much of a problem, but I haven't tried Ubuntu yet (the disc I burnt to test it out was hosed)
15:10	---	<<-- david [~dcoulson@muffin.davidcoulson.net] has quit (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
15:11	dataw0lf	caker: Nah, it shouldn't be a problem, although Ubuntu does have a focus toward Gnome development and desktop usage.
15:11	@caker	dataw0lf: is it possible to rootstrap an Ubuntu install?
15:11	dataw0lf	caker: Hm, let me see if the deb package is in the repos.
15:11	@caker	dataw0lf: if I could run the install process under UML, it would be easier, too. But my usual method of installing onto a physical box and coping it off isn't that much of a problem
15:12	dataw0lf	caker: Yeah, it supports rootstrapping.
15:12	@caker	dataw0lf: joy :)
15:12	dataw0lf	caker: it's kind of in the 'Ubuntu' methodology, as well. Ubuntu doesn't have a root user by default.
15:13	@caker	dataw0lf: so I've heard. That will conflict with how my distro wizard works (basically, makes a copy of a template install, and then changes the root user's password for the user to log into for first access) ...
15:14	adamg	could you not create a root user?
15:14	dataw0lf	caker: Well, it's all based around a sudo methodology, Ubuntu uses the Debian installer, so when you set the 'root' password during the install, it is actually just a user with sudo privileges.
15:14	@caker	adamg: yeah, but Ubuntu is a sudo only distro (first of its kind, I believe)
15:15	adamg	well a user called root then that is just a regular user with sudo privs
15:15	@caker	dataw0lf: the distro wizard modifies the root entry in /etc/[passwd\|shadow] directly
15:16	@caker	adamg: I thought of that, but that would be very confusing
15:16	dataw0lf	caker: ah, that could be a problem, unless your 'first' user was a named root.
15:16		* caker yells out HACK
15:16	dataw0lf	It's easy enough to create a root account, obviously. (passwd root should do it)
15:16	@caker	yeah
15:16	dataw0lf	Honestly, I've done so myself.
15:16	adamg	or you would have to modify your deploy routine to set the password for a user other than root
15:16	@caker	ok. I'll just have to break users out of the "do everything as root" habit with Ubuntu
15:17	adamg	a habit I need to get out of
15:17	dataw0lf	heh, I'll admit prefixing everything with sudo is pretty tedious.
15:17	tierra\|h_	well, if the user chooses Ubuntu, they do so with that knowledge
15:17	---	User: *** tierra\|h_ is now known as tierra\|h
15:18	tierra\|h	if that's what Ubuntu is aiming for anyway
15:21	dataw0lf	Yeah, but all the hardcore Ubuntu guys I know just add a root account anyway.
15:23	dataw0lf	my main attraction to Ubuntu was the Python focus, honestly.
15:24	dataw0lf	Plus they (Canonical) offers 'bounties' for Python scripts.
15:25	adamg	I think will stick to debian/gentoo
15:26	dataw0lf	For server usage I still use Debian (and FreeBSD).
15:29	adamg	I think I will be putting debian on everything I set-up from now on
15:30	@caker	Ubuntu's advantage is a much more frequent release schedule, and I imagine much more recent packages
15:30	adamg	true, debian stable is getting rather outdated
15:31	dataw0lf	Yeah, Ubuntu has some very good packages as far as desktop use is concerned.
15:31	dataw0lf	As well as great support for Apache 2.
15:31	dataw0lf	But, like, I don't think they have the php5 as a package, with some other things some people think is key.
15:32	adamg	the only thing that puts me off debian, 2.6 and uml is the tls issue
15:34	tierra\|h	that's an issue with every distro isn't it? it's just debian is trying to move into just using tls?
15:34	@caker	Woody is so old, it doesnt' have an NPTL enabled libc
15:35	tierra\|h	err, yeah, meant nptl
15:35	dataw0lf	heh, yeah, I noticed that, caker.
15:35	adamg	is the same problem in testing?
15:35	dataw0lf	Nah.
15:35	@caker	adamg: testing and unstable DO have NPTL enabled libcs
15:36	@caker	Out of all the distros, .deb based ones have the divert advantage, and handle it the best way, IMO
15:37	adamg	at least I can use testing and 2.6 then
15:37	@caker	right
15:37	dataw0lf	caker: I agree.
15:37	dataw0lf	apt-get/dpkg combo is pretty win.
15:37	@caker	Woody needs other things to work well under 2.6 (back-ports psutils, for example)
15:38	@caker	Woody's top gets pretty freaked out under 2.6
15:38	---	<<-- jared555 [~jared555@dialup-4.159.98.219.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net] has quit (Quit: Leaving)
15:38	adamg	cool means I can look at using 2.6 with debian for the new project, since it works better with some of the apps I will be running
15:38	@caker	ugh .. only 22% through the first reject file for cfq-ts and 2.6.10
15:39	adamg	ouch
15:39	@caker	it's the biggest of the bunch, though
15:39	adamg	still not good
15:41	adamg	how is cfq looking on the hosts which have been restarted recently
15:42	@caker	Good, although I expect this version to perform waaaay better. cfq-ts on those hosts was based on cfq-ts v7 or so. This one is v21
15:43	adamg	nie
15:43	adamg	nice even
15:49	---	---> DarkSSJ [~darkssj@82.53.166.249] has joined #linode
16:06	---	---> thoth39 [~hm@200216084191.user.veloxzone.com.br] has joined #linode
16:12	---	<<-- ossido [~ossido@52.68.63.81.cust.bluewin.ch] has quit (Ping timeout: 480 seconds)
16:13	---	---> david [~dcoulson@muffin.davidcoulson.net] has joined #linode
16:14	---	User: *** david is now known as Guest232
16:17	---	---> Redgore_ [Redgore@195.38.75.106] has joined #linode
16:17	---	<<-- Redgore [Redgore@195.38.75.106] has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
16:17	---	User: *** Redgore_ is now known as Redgore
16:21	---	---> ossido [~ossido@199.10.63.81.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #linode
16:28	---	User: *** Guest232 is now known as david
16:41	@caker	41% through now ..
16:44		* adamg remebers why he hates maths
16:47	adamg	dang still no sighup
16:47	---	---> jared555 [~jared555@dialup-4.159.98.232.Dial1.Chicago1.Level3.net] has joined #linode
16:47	adamg	!4-1
16:47	adamg	!math 4-1
16:47	adamg	linode help
16:48	adamg	linbot help
16:48	@linbot	adamg: (help [<plugin>] <command>) -- This command gives a useful description of what <command> does. <plugin> is only necessary if the command is in more than one plugin.
16:48	adamg	linbot help maths
16:48	adamg	!google 4-1
16:48	@caker	!calc 4-1
16:48	@linbot	caker: 4 - 1 = 3
16:48	adamg	caker: Invalid Google license key.
16:48	@caker	adamg: that's bs
16:48	@caker	I have one added already ..
16:48	@caker	!config search google
16:48	@linbot	caker: supybot.plugins.Google, supybot.plugins.Google.public, supybot.plugins.Google.groupsSnarfer, supybot.plugins.Google.searchSnarfer, supybot.plugins.Google.colorfulFilter, supybot.plugins.Google.bold, supybot.plugins.Google.maximumResults, supybot.plugins.Google.defaultLanguage, supybot.plugins.Google.safeSearch, supybot.plugins.Google.licenseKey, supybot.plugins.Google.state, (1 more message)
16:49	@caker	!config supybot.plugins.Google.licenseKey
16:49	adamg	thats what linbot says
16:49	@caker	adamg: use !calc
16:49	@caker	!calc 1 gallon in liters
16:49	@linbot	caker: 1 US gallon = 3.7854118 liters
16:49	adamg	yeah I will do, to many bots with different commands
16:50	adamg	!calc 31 - (22-1)
16:50	@linbot	adamg: 31 - (22 - 1) = 10
16:50	adamg	looks good enough for the prorata
16:50	---	<<-- DarkSSJ [~darkssj@82.53.166.249] has quit (Quit: Leaving)
16:57	adamg	!calc (5/31) * 10
16:57	@linbot	adamg: (5 / 31) * 10 = 1.61290323
16:58	fo0bar	!calc c in rods per sidereal day
16:58	@linbot	fo0bar: the speed of light = 5.13627306 * 10^(12) rods per sidereal day
16:58	fo0bar	:)
17:00	jared555	sorry if this is metioned somewhere, but is one of your boxes down (at the planet) at the moment?
17:03	@caker	jared555: no .. username?
17:04	jared555	the owner of the account isn't on atm, only thing I know is the IP, that it is here, and it isn't responding on ping/traceroute
17:05	@caker	jared555: ok, what's the IP?
17:05	jared555	64.5.53.182
17:05	jared555	tried traceroute/ping from both my home connection, and a SM server
17:06	@caker	jared555: He sent me a ticket a while ago, which I responded to with what to do
17:06	jared555	ok, sorry
17:07	jared555	hadn't seen him on today so I didn't know he had contacted you
17:09	jared555	I will not bother you anymore then
17:14	rafx	need help...all the config dialogs (curses) have funky looking characters for borders rather than the straight lines. i think these chars are whats causing screen to lockup. this only happens on the linode upgraded to sarge, and i'm using same locale on all my boxes (en_US)
17:15	@caker	rafx: which kernel?
17:15	rafx	latest-2.4, about to reboot to 2.6 to try it out too
17:16	@caker	rafx: yeah, since 2.6.9-bb4, UML has a re-written console codebase
17:16	rafx	it basically causes woody->sarge upgrades to freeze now
17:16	mikegrb	what does echo $TERM say?
17:16	rafx	it says linux
17:16	@caker	rafx: does this happen over ssh, Lish, or just in screen?
17:16	rafx	Lish
17:16	rafx	lemme check ssh...
17:17	mikegrb	you might try "export TERM=screen" and see if that hels in lish
17:18	mikegrb	especially if it works okay via ssh
17:18	rafx	aha! it only happens in Lish, ssh is fine
17:18	rafx	i was going insane over this problem today
17:19	mikegrb	try the export TERM=screen
17:19	rafx	ok
17:20	@caker	I think the console-rewrite fixes that
17:20	rafx	mikegrb: yep, that fixes it. export TERM=screen works
17:22	mikegrb	:D
17:22	rafx	should've asked for help here instead of #debian at 6am this morning
17:23	---	<<-- shakr [~kenn2@whirl.gellin.dyndns.org] has quit (Quit: Leaving)
17:31	---	---> DJohn [~john@249-13-77-66.etheric.net] has joined #linode
17:31	DJohn	caker, yt?
17:32	@caker	DJohn: yup
17:32	DJohn	how do i unsignup for ips i'm no longer using?
17:33	@caker	DJohn: send me a ticket, and before the end of the month I'll remove them (requires a reboot)
17:33	DJohn	k
17:36	---	<--- DJohn [~john@249-13-77-66.etheric.net] has left #linode ()
17:41		* linbot breakdances
17:43	rafx	which locale do you guys use? assuming english, which of en_US, en_US.utf8, en_US.iso8519... is most recommended?
17:48	---	---> shakr [~kenn2@whirl.gellin.dyndns.org] has joined #linode
17:49	fo0bar	rafx: I usually set it to straight en_US, after getting burned by the problems caused with en_US.utf8 being default in RHL8
17:59	fo0bar	io_count=515124 io_rate=572 io_tokens=44 token_refill=512 token_max=400000
17:59	fo0bar	^^^ wow
18:00	fo0bar	I forgot that's even possible, since my main linode is a higher plan (lower contention I would imagine)
18:08	adamg	your io_tokens was low
18:08	adamg	you must have been hitting the io
18:08	fo0bar	yeah, I was doing a yum update on a new deployment
18:09	thoth39	I used to get these weird character menus until I found out how to configure the character map to use in PuTTY.
18:09	fo0bar	the point is, I've never seen it empty on my 192
18:09	rafx	fo0bar: thanks, i have it set to en_US now but was wondering if en_US.utf8 would be better. glad i asked
18:10	fo0bar	rafx: my fears may be irrational these day, but it doesn't seem to hurt anything
18:14	@caker	fo0bar: need an ioboost, or are you all set now?
18:15	@caker	I've had a few requests for a Lish feature to inject some io tokens, with perhaps a restriction per hour, or something... Sounds like a good idea
18:16	adamg	or you could just write the watch program you where going on about ages ago
18:16	adamg	change token setting depending on the host load etc
18:16	@caker	yeah, I still have some of that around somewhere...
18:16	fo0bar	caker: well, normally it wouldn't be a problem, but this initial update looks like it will take forever
18:17	@caker	fo0bar: which Linode?
18:17	fo0bar	procsecure, host18
18:17	@caker	adamg: yeah. Remember a long while ago when all the nodes on a few hosts went down, like one or two hosts in a row until I reverted a change?
18:17	adamg	not really
18:18	---	<<-- Redgore [Redgore@195.38.75.106] has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
18:18	@caker	adamg: that still scares me, although a few months ago when I resurrected that code I ran some tests, and I couldn't get it to crash any Linodes... (the change read a file in Linode:/proc every minute)
18:18	fo0bar	caker: wait, hmm
18:18	---	---> Redgore [Redgore@195.38.75.106] has joined #linode
18:18	fo0bar	io_count=751698 io_rate=0 io_tokens=337422 token_refill=512 token_max=400000
18:18	fo0bar	seems it's just cpu-bound now
18:18	@caker	http://www.linode.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=25 <-- last few entries on that page refer to it
18:18	adamg	oh I remeber now
18:19	adamg	hopefully cfq will allow you to losen up the io limiter
18:20	@caker	either way, the deficiencies in the token-limiter will be there until the io-watchdog stuff comes along
18:20	@caker	oh .. that reminds me. I need to port the limiter to 2.6.11. Lots of stuff moved around in UML since 2.6.10 :/
18:21	@caker	57% done on the cfq-ts port for the first file: http://www.theshore.net/~caker/cfq-ts-rejects.txt
18:21	adamg	yeah should remove alot of issues when the watchdog comes in and cfq is on all the machines
18:22	@caker	CFQ will perform better under contention, but I'm assuming thrashers/etc will still have a visible impact on the host
18:22	@caker	*cfq-ts, that is
18:23	adamg	yeah thats the thing nothing bar the limiter will stop the thrashers
18:25	adamg	yay once again got feck all done today
18:25	@caker	adamg: have you looked into existing F/OSS billing apps?
18:26	adamg	no, I prefer to write my own even if it does take a while, at least that why I have 100% control over it
18:27	@caker	Freeside comes up often on my ISP mailing lists
18:28	@caker	I recall using a few of them for research, when designing mine
18:29	adamg	i have used a few before while working on other peoples systems, but they all seem to lack in certain areas
18:32	@caker	adamg: Do you use objects in perl at all, or just straight procedural?
18:32	adamg	both, all of my web stuff is based around cgi::application
18:33	@caker	cgi::application looks very useful
18:33	adamg	yeah, the scanner interface is all based behind it
18:35	adamg	a very, very small part of the api is based on it as well, well the opening and closing of the db
18:37	fo0bar	caker: hey, do you know of any customers who actually takes advantage of an initrd though lpm?
18:37	@caker	fo0bar: One user asked for it to do root-LVM stuff, but I think he figured out another way without using it. I could see pivotroot or some other uses for it
18:38	adamg	as caker fires up mysqlcc
18:38	fo0bar	ahh
18:39	@caker	yeah, lemme do a query and see if anyone is using it :)
18:40	@caker	heh, there's 6 images with initrd type
18:40	adamg	anyone actually set it in a config profile?
18:40	@caker	make that three, out of active accounts
18:40	fo0bar	that question came up as I noticed yum updating lvm... I'm not sure why someone would really desire lvm on a uml instance
18:40	fo0bar	but it would require initrd functionality
18:41	@caker	fo0bar: well, esp since someone can resize
18:41	fo0bar	exactly
18:41	@caker	fo0bar: the same question came re: raid support in the Linode kernels
18:41	fo0bar	hehehehe
18:41	@caker	fo0bar: my answer was that stuff might be useful for staging/testing environments
18:41	fo0bar	"I want to do RAID1 over 2 images that reside in the same directory on the host"
18:42	@caker	Yup
18:42	adamg	i remember someone asking that, did seem rather pointless
18:42	@caker	But, for example, the bridging support in the Linode kernels I use -- I have a Linode Image that I do host development in
18:44	fo0bar	ooo, just had a legitimate though
18:44	fo0bar	thought
18:45	adamg	all your other thoughts illeagal then
18:45	@caker	bastard thoughts
18:45	fo0bar	I don't trust caker, so I want to have my root partition be encrypted, and use 2.6's dmcrypt, but that would require an initrd which would ask for my password on console before it accessed the encrypted root partition
18:47	adamg	heh
18:47	@caker	I sometimes have a hard time realizing why an initrd would be needed for that. Couldn't that be accomplished with a normal image with the needed binaries?
18:47	@caker	It's been a long while since I've done initrd stuff
18:48		* caker puts on his "I read your email" t-shirt
18:50	@caker	how's the rash?
18:50	fo0bar	I can't remember the specifics, but say you have an encrypted filesystem on /dev/ubda... you do something like "be_paranoid /dev/ubda /dev/i_am_paranoid" -- that util asks for a decryption key, then remains in memory to access /dev/ubda on a block level, and decrypt on the fly to /dev/i_am_paranoid
18:50	fo0bar	then you mount /dev/i_am_paranoid like a normal device
18:51	fo0bar	the problem comes when you have a root filesystem, you must do all this in an initrd, then pivot_root so that new filesystem becomes /
18:51	@caker	ok, so it saves you a ubd device slot
18:52	fo0bar	no, you ubd partition is encrypted at a block level, and that utility just decrypts/encrypts on the fly, and maps to a virtual device
18:53	@caker	Just like apache and certs if you don't save your keys
18:53	@caker	Which would be a PITA for reboots
18:53	adamg	or if you just dont use a key
18:55	fo0bar	caker: yeah, well, you have to input something... because you can't save your key/passphrase (if all of your paritions are encrypted, where are you going to put it? cmdline? that would defeat the purpose because caker is evil and can read your cmdline)
18:56	fo0bar	but yeah, you would have to enter the passphrase at each boot
18:56	fo0bar	which would be impractical here
18:56	@caker	but I/evil-BOFH could capture your phrase, too
18:56	fo0bar	true
18:57	---	<<-- anderiv [~anderiv@207.67.87.34] has quit (Read error: Operation timed out)
18:57	fo0bar	dmcrypt is more suited for protecting laptops, where you are right in front of the computer when it is powering on
18:57	@caker	I'd say placing them into a config profile would be a good method, but if the host/Linode was compromised you might as well have unencrypted images
18:57	fo0bar	and if the laptop is stolen, all they have is a set of encrypted partitions
19:00	fo0bar	sorry, I've been saying dmcrypt, when I mean dm-crypt
19:00	fo0bar	no wonder google wasn't giving much
19:00	---	---> anderiv [~anderiv@207-67-87-34.gen.twtelecom.net] has joined #linode
19:00	fo0bar	http://gentoo-wiki.com/SECURITY_Encrypting_Root_Filesystem_with_DM-Crypt <-- here's how to do it with gentoo
19:00	fo0bar	which I mean to do on my laptop one day
19:03	@caker	linbot: weather 19019
19:03	@linbot	caker: The current temperature in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania is 21�F (6:54 PM EST on January 22, 2005). Conditions: Light Snow Showers Mist. Humidity: 88%. Dew Point: 18�F. Pressure: 29.61 in (1003 hPa). Visibility: 2.5 miles (4.0 kilometers). UV: 0 out of 12
19:04	@caker	Snow accumulating 8 to 12 inches. ugh
19:04	@caker	First time they've closed Philly airport in 9 years, or something
19:05	alnr	its really sticking here in manhattan
19:05	adamg	hopefully they will be able to clear it by monday
19:06	adamg	oh well thats the purchase frame work done, just got the service specific code to do
19:06	fo0bar	caker: how's 2.6 client support? I noticed it says [experimental] and was thinking of switching my main one over to 2.6
19:07	@caker	fo0bar: The experimental label was there to curb /lib/tls tickets, then it was there for a good reason -- 2.6 crashed often due to the bug that was fixed last week
19:07	@caker	fo0bar: so, I'd recommend it more now than ever.
19:08	fo0bar	"caker's seal of approval!"
19:08	fo0bar	thanks :)
19:08	adamg	first time I used 2.6 when caker first put it out, it scrwed my gentoo images
19:08	@caker	adamg: I still don't see how that's possible, but ...
19:08	adamg	neither do i
19:08	@caker	that was like the first 2.6-um kernel, iirc
19:09	adamg	yep
19:09	adamg	i think it was the first 2.6 host as well as it required a host move iirc
19:10	@caker	I need to suck everything into cvs or the like
19:10	adamg	yeah I started using svn
19:11	adamg	has it's uses
19:11	@caker	a lot of these rejects I'm fixing seem like patch(1) should have been able to find it
19:12	@caker	I made it as fuzzy as it would go .. I'm doing more manually than I should have to
19:24	@caker	ooo
19:24	@caker	-l -- ignore whitespace
19:25	@caker	nice, that did it -- only a few small rejects to fix now
19:26	adamg	cool
19:26	adamg	all those people trying to tidy code by using spaces and tabs
19:38	@caker	more like the mailing list ate the tabs
19:56	dataw0lf	any of you guys built Gentoo on Sparc architecture ?
19:58	dataw0lf	I just ordered a pallet of 1/E+ Ultra workstations, heh, I was thinking of putting Gentoo on em and clustering them.
20:00	@caker	"a pallet" :)
20:00	fo0bar	yeah, I've installed gentoo on a U1 before... it's slow, but works fine
20:01	dataw0lf	caker: yeah, 15 of the buggers :))
20:01	dataw0lf	fo0bar: danke.
20:01	@caker	Previous value when new: $200k, current value: $500 bucks
20:01	@caker	(including shipping)
20:01	dataw0lf	hehe, yeah, bout right.
20:02	dataw0lf	I'm going to wait til the xbox drops a little more in price, then I want to cluster like 5 of those for a media center. hehe.
20:05	@caker	linbot: 2.6-skas?
20:05	@linbot	http://uml.tuxrocks.com/Patches/host-skas3-2.6.10-v7.patch
20:06	@caker	linbot: no, 2.6-skas is <reply>http://www.user-mode-linux.org/~blaisorblade/patches/skas3-2.6/host-skas3-2.6.10-v7.patch
20:06	@linbot	10-4, caker.
20:06	fo0bar	we have one server running RHL6.1 left that has not yet been migrated... I assumed it was like a 300mhz machine, 32-64MB ram... something you would typically have at the time of RHL6.1...
20:07	fo0bar	but no, it's a dual-proc P2 700mhz, 1GB ram
20:07	dataw0lf	heh.
20:07	@caker	fo0bar: that's begging to be moved into an UML
20:07	@caker	oh
20:07	dataw0lf	you want to hear a horror story?
20:07	fo0bar	and I tought "wow, this cost a mint when it was first commissioned"
20:07	fo0bar	must have I mean
20:07	dataw0lf	the company I just got done consulting for, the lead sys admin was running X + Gnome on his primary server.
20:08	dataw0lf	So that the server configuration was 'easier'.
20:08	@caker	what, no SETI screen saver like all the DB and webservers at my previous job?
20:08	@caker	^-- common story
20:08	fo0bar	caker: nah, I proposed using UML to the company... they're trying to get away from shared and smaller-dedicated hosting
20:08	dataw0lf	no shit, he had the random xscreesaver running on it.
20:09	@caker	I just know the majority of the 100%-cpu consuming Linodes (which promptly get niced-up) are likely running distributed.net or something
20:09	dataw0lf	heh, nice is every sys admin's friend.
20:10	@caker	that will also be a component of the Linode-watchdog thing
20:10	@caker	(nicing stuff)
20:10	fo0bar	heh
20:10	@caker	cfq-ts has awesome io priorities, and works VERY well
20:11	fo0bar	they have every right to run distributed/seti... of course you also have to provide no more processing power than you advertise
20:11	dataw0lf	heh, no shit.
20:11	@caker	I'm hoping to crank up sshd's priority, to prevent me from being locked out of hosts during thrashers. Currently, I keep screen sessions open all over the place to each box
20:11	@caker	fo0bar: yup
20:12	@caker	I often log into hosts and discover a few cpu-spinners have been going for quite a while, and no one else has complained, so I'm happy with CPU distribution
20:12	fo0bar	damnit!
20:13	fo0bar	now I have the urge to switch over my laptop to dm-crypt
20:14	dataw0lf	what type of lappy do you have?
20:15	fo0bar	dell inspiron 5150, 2.66ghz, 512MB, 60GB drive
20:15	dataw0lf	Nice.
20:15	fo0bar	yeah, I like it
20:16	dataw0lf	I just got a 1.7ghz, 512 ram, 40 gig for free, it was pretty swete.
20:16	fo0bar	it has a nice video card (geforcefx 5200 go), it's relatively light, and if I tweak the power management settings a lot, I can get about 9 hours battery out of it
20:17	dataw0lf	Nice, I haven't really screwed with this one, just installed Ubuntu on it and got everything working.
20:18	fo0bar	I have ubuntu on a few desktops... this laptop has gentoo though
20:18	dataw0lf	yeah, I love Ubuntu for desktop / laptop use.
20:18	---	<<-- Redgore [Redgore@195.38.75.106] has quit (Read error: Connection reset by peer)
20:19	---	---> Redgore [Redgore@195.38.75.106] has joined #linode
20:33	@caker	Anyone know where I can find a fix for http://isec.pl/vulnerabilities/isec-0022-pagefault.txt ?
20:39	@caker	found it
20:39	@caker	http://dev.gentoo.org/~dsd/gentoo-dev-sources/release-10.07/dist/1140_stack-resize.patch
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22:17	@linbot	multipass
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22:29	fo0bar	19:17 <@linbot> multipass
22:29	fo0bar	leeloo dallas multipass!
22:29	@linbot	bada boom
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22:34		* linbot reports that host41 (L96) is now online
22:37	fo0bar	linbot is a jerk
22:37	@linbot	Wish I knew, fo0bar.
22:38		* linbot does his business on fo0bar's leg
22:38	fo0bar	:)
22:45	mikegrb	fo0bar: I think linbot likes you, watch your legs
22:46		* linbot reports that host42 (L64) is now online
22:47		* linbot is the wind beneath your wings
22:47		* linbot smells like teen spirit
22:47		* linbot has got a gun
22:48	mikegrb	tbe whole worlds come undone
22:48		* linbot can't drive 55
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23:31	SupaDongzu	whoa
23:32	SupaDongzu	has linbot gone all markov?
23:33	mikegrb	SupaDongzu: I lub you
23:33	SupaDongzu	oh hi
23:34	mikegrb	SupaDongzu: linbot has someone's hand up his butt.
23:34	SupaDongzu	Oh.
23:34	SupaDongzu	That.
23:42		* linbot moshes with SupaDongzu
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---	Log	closed Sun Jan 23 00:00:47 2005